00:00:00,060 --> 00:00:03,300 [Speaker 0]
Here is that what is different from before

00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:06,440 [Speaker 0]
of the many years is that the Department

00:00:06,580 --> 00:00:09,220 [Speaker 0]
of War now, what was previous-- When I

00:00:09,300 --> 00:00:11,020 [Speaker 0]
work-- when I said I would do this, it was

00:00:11,080 --> 00:00:14,560 [Speaker 0]
the Department of Defense, um, created an

00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:17,530 [Speaker 0]
office as a part of the Pentagon called

00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:19,450 [Speaker 0]
the Hawaii Coordination Cell.

00:00:20,360 --> 00:00:22,780 [Speaker 0]
Because in listening to everything, in

00:00:22,860 --> 00:00:25,860 [Speaker 0]
hearing the narrative, they wanted to

00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:27,800 [Speaker 0]
create an office that would report

00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:31,060 [Speaker 0]
directly to the Assistant Secretary of

00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:33,720 [Speaker 0]
Energy Installations and Environment, as

00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:36,410 [Speaker 0]
opposed to being out here in Hawaii and

00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:39,570 [Speaker 0]
having to let the message go through, uh,

00:00:39,600 --> 00:00:42,180 [Speaker 0]
the hundreds of people that get there. But

00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:44,780 [Speaker 0]
they created this office that I am a part

00:00:44,880 --> 00:00:45,180 [Speaker 0]
of

00:00:45,820 --> 00:00:49,320 [Speaker 0]
to communicate directly with community,

00:00:49,380 --> 00:00:52,510 [Speaker 0]
with Hawaii residents, and report straight

00:00:52,540 --> 00:00:56,290 [Speaker 0]
back up to the key decision-makers within

00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:58,589 [Speaker 0]
the office of the Secretary of

00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:00,420 [Speaker 0]
War. So

00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:04,340 [Speaker 0]
that is the role that I have in leading

00:01:04,379 --> 00:01:07,400 [Speaker 0]
this office. It's brand new, um, and I

00:01:07,440 --> 00:01:10,240 [Speaker 0]
will honestly tell you, half my job is-- I

00:01:10,300 --> 00:01:13,720 [Speaker 0]
like this part. I understand this part,

00:01:13,740 --> 00:01:15,700 [Speaker 0]
talking with everybody. I've known and

00:01:15,740 --> 00:01:17,200 [Speaker 0]
worked with many of you and had the

00:01:17,220 --> 00:01:19,110 [Speaker 0]
privilege of knowing Uncle Charlie and

00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:21,660 [Speaker 0]
Uncle Ed as well. Um,

00:01:22,480 --> 00:01:24,580 [Speaker 0]
the hard part of my job is when I go back

00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:25,420 [Speaker 0]
to the Pentagon,

00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:29,020 [Speaker 0]
and I have to explain all of this mana'o

00:01:29,700 --> 00:01:32,620 [Speaker 0]
and translate it in ways to help them

00:01:32,630 --> 00:01:35,520 [Speaker 0]
understand. And i-it is in that spirit

00:01:35,530 --> 00:01:38,080 [Speaker 0]
that we are all here today, and really

00:01:38,120 --> 00:01:40,880 [Speaker 0]
thank you. We've been-- I've been asking,

00:01:40,940 --> 00:01:42,760 [Speaker 0]
how do we, how do we do a community

00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:46,810 [Speaker 0]
meeting where we're not, um... And this--

00:01:46,860 --> 00:01:48,410 [Speaker 0]
The attorney in me has to tell you this is

00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:52,180 [Speaker 0]
not an official EIS, but the EIS is a

00:01:52,280 --> 00:01:55,060 [Speaker 0]
statutory requirement that says if you're

00:01:55,100 --> 00:01:57,620 [Speaker 0]
gonna do a project, you gotta say the

00:01:57,840 --> 00:02:00,060 [Speaker 0]
biggest footprint, the highest you would

00:02:00,100 --> 00:02:03,120 [Speaker 0]
go, and all the negative things you would

00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:06,140 [Speaker 0]
have. That's, uh, that's that process. In

00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:09,120 [Speaker 0]
this process, which I hope that we are in,

00:02:09,180 --> 00:02:11,340 [Speaker 0]
it's to talk about, okay, that's the

00:02:11,380 --> 00:02:15,100 [Speaker 0]
range of this is the biggest and most

00:02:15,260 --> 00:02:18,460 [Speaker 0]
impact if they did this. And then we

00:02:18,500 --> 00:02:21,200 [Speaker 0]
clearly hear where people are tonight,

00:02:21,260 --> 00:02:24,020 [Speaker 0]
which is we want you to do nothing, right?

00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:26,620 [Speaker 0]
And there's a, there's a range in between

00:02:27,180 --> 00:02:28,160 [Speaker 0]
that we can

00:02:29,060 --> 00:02:29,960 [Speaker 0]
talk about

00:02:30,800 --> 00:02:35,150 [Speaker 0]
in terms of mission and what is there, um,

00:02:35,220 --> 00:02:37,380 [Speaker 0]
and it is in that spirit that we come to

00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:39,910 [Speaker 0]
answer questions and talk story. So I just

00:02:39,940 --> 00:02:41,590 [Speaker 0]
wanted to share that 'cause this is

00:02:41,620 --> 00:02:42,540 [Speaker 0]
different in that

00:02:43,460 --> 00:02:45,980 [Speaker 0]
that's, that's the difference in the role

00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:46,640 [Speaker 0]
that we have

00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:50,430 [Speaker 0]
and definitely understand the history and

00:02:50,460 --> 00:02:52,590 [Speaker 0]
the pattern of the department. And with

00:02:52,590 --> 00:02:55,560 [Speaker 0]
that, I wanna ask, um, Doug to introduce

00:02:55,580 --> 00:02:56,580 [Speaker 0]
himself.

00:02:56,640 --> 00:02:59,140 [Speaker 1]
Thank you, Noe. Uh, hi, I'm Doug Thorne.

00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:00,520 [Speaker 1]
I'm the commander here at the Fifteenth

00:03:00,640 --> 00:03:02,940 [Speaker 1]
Space Surveillance Squadron. Uh, I wanna

00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:04,800 [Speaker 1]
thank you for this opportunity to continue

00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:06,750 [Speaker 1]
the dialogue that we've been having, uh,

00:03:06,780 --> 00:03:08,260 [Speaker 1]
after at the town halls. I hope it doesn't

00:03:08,300 --> 00:03:09,980 [Speaker 1]
end after this, and we can continue after

00:03:10,020 --> 00:03:12,710 [Speaker 1]
this. I brought, uh, several members of

00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:15,450 [Speaker 1]
my squadron here with me today. Uh, I

00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:18,460 [Speaker 1]
just-- In full honesty, we decided to, uh,

00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:19,840 [Speaker 1]
wear civilian clothes today 'cause we

00:03:19,880 --> 00:03:21,280 [Speaker 1]
understand sometimes when we wear our

00:03:21,340 --> 00:03:22,900 [Speaker 1]
uniform, it creates a barrier when we

00:03:22,920 --> 00:03:24,920 [Speaker 1]
communicate with the community, so we

00:03:24,940 --> 00:03:27,460 [Speaker 1]
wanted to make sure we didn't have that,

00:03:27,540 --> 00:03:30,000 [Speaker 1]
uh, uh, for here today. Uh, so next, I'll

00:03:30,020 --> 00:03:32,120 [Speaker 1]
allow my other members of my squadron to

00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:35,540 [Speaker 1]
introduce themselves.

00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:40,350 [Speaker 2]
Aloha. My name is Major Ayla Reed. Uh, I

00:03:40,380 --> 00:03:42,230 [Speaker 2]
work in the squadron. Uh, I'm the chief

00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:43,540 [Speaker 2]
engineer at the Maui High Performance

00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:45,510 [Speaker 2]
Computing Center. Thank you very much for

00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:47,500 [Speaker 2]
allowing us to be here today and to

00:03:47,540 --> 00:03:50,130 [Speaker 2]
converse with you all.

00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,049 [Speaker 3]
Hi, everybody. Richard Chong. I usually

00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:58,390 [Speaker 3]
hide in the back, but, um, I'm one of the

00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:01,220 [Speaker 3]
senior civilians with the Space Force. I

00:04:01,260 --> 00:04:05,160 [Speaker 3]
support the colonel here. Uh, from Hilo,

00:04:05,200 --> 00:04:08,200 [Speaker 3]
proud Hilo boy. Um, went to the better

00:04:08,300 --> 00:04:11,040 [Speaker 3]
school than somebody else over here. Uh

00:04:11,260 --> 00:04:14,400 [Speaker 3]
[laughing] [audience cheering] Uh, a lot

00:04:14,420 --> 00:04:16,029 [Speaker 3]
of you guys know me. I, um,

00:04:16,640 --> 00:04:18,519 [Speaker 3]
one thing you might not know is I think I

00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:21,660 [Speaker 3]
was the second local boy that the, the

00:04:21,700 --> 00:04:21,990 [Speaker 3]
military brought home-

00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:23,600 [Speaker 0]
Brother, can you move the mic more close

00:04:23,620 --> 00:04:23,969 [Speaker 0]
to your mouth?

00:04:23,980 --> 00:04:24,040 [Speaker 3]
Oh.

00:04:24,060 --> 00:04:25,740 [Speaker 0]
Sorry, I cannot hear you.

00:04:25,780 --> 00:04:28,330 [Speaker 3]
I was the second one that they brought

00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:32,240 [Speaker 3]
home to, to, to come back home. And since

00:04:32,280 --> 00:04:34,400 [Speaker 3]
two thousand and nine, we've always had

00:04:35,180 --> 00:04:38,480 [Speaker 3]
presence here. I mean, Hilo, of course,

00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:41,900 [Speaker 3]
not Maui, but, uh, Molokai, you

00:04:41,940 --> 00:04:46,190 [Speaker 3]
know, uh, Kihei, upcountry Wailuku, but

00:04:46,220 --> 00:04:47,930 [Speaker 3]
throughout-- and a lot of Oahu and stuff.

00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:50,560 [Speaker 3]
But a lot of us that do serve and a lot of

00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:51,570 [Speaker 3]
us that do come home

00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:55,130 [Speaker 3]
and have the opportunity to work here,

00:04:55,140 --> 00:04:55,540 [Speaker 3]
right home,

00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:58,070 [Speaker 3]
it's very special, and we've tried to keep

00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:00,770 [Speaker 3]
that going since two thousand and nine.

00:05:00,820 --> 00:05:02,240 [Speaker 3]
Actually, you know what? Before that,

00:05:02,300 --> 00:05:04,090 [Speaker 3]
since two thousand and something. Some of

00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:06,340 [Speaker 3]
you guys know Coach, retired senior master

00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:07,200 [Speaker 3]
sergeant. I'm not gonna

00:05:07,860 --> 00:05:08,500 [Speaker 3]
say his name, but

00:05:09,220 --> 00:05:11,940 [Speaker 3]
he's, he's been here way before me. So

00:05:12,220 --> 00:05:14,040 [Speaker 3]
thank you.

00:05:14,100 --> 00:05:15,700 [Speaker 0]
Okay. Find, find the sweet spot on the

00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:17,260 [Speaker 0]
mic, yeah, 'cause we wanna hear you.

00:05:17,460 --> 00:05:18,990 [Speaker 3]
Just get inside them, right?

00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:19,099 [Speaker 3]
[audience laughing]

00:05:19,180 --> 00:05:20,620 [Speaker 0]
Don't be afraid.

00:05:22,440 --> 00:05:25,480 [Speaker 4]
Hey, good evening. I'm Major Ray Molina. I

00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:27,300 [Speaker 4]
am the, um, mission assurance flight

00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:29,250 [Speaker 4]
commander for the Fifteenth Space, uh,

00:05:29,340 --> 00:05:30,960 [Speaker 4]
Surveillance Squadron. Essentially, I just

00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:33,690 [Speaker 4]
do all the support needed for, uh, for

00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:35,850 [Speaker 4]
the mission here. Uh, and I'm from, I'm

00:05:35,860 --> 00:05:38,320 [Speaker 4]
from Kihei. Thank you.

00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:41,280 [Speaker 0]
Where in Kihei?

00:05:41,300 --> 00:05:41,610 [Speaker 4]
Kihei.

00:05:41,610 --> 00:05:43,840 [Speaker 0]
Kihei.

00:05:45,180 --> 00:05:47,720 [Speaker 5]
Aloha, everyone. Uh, my name is Cody

00:05:47,740 --> 00:05:51,520 [Speaker 5]
Felipe. I am from Pukalani, Maui. Um,

00:05:51,640 --> 00:05:52,210 [Speaker 5]
I've--

00:05:53,100 --> 00:05:55,620 [Speaker 5]
At least my role here, I, I'm not in the

00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:58,620 [Speaker 5]
squadron, but I've been in the places

00:05:58,700 --> 00:06:01,120 [Speaker 5]
that, um, in Hawaii, the Space Forces

00:06:01,220 --> 00:06:05,452 [Speaker 5]
unitsSpecifically 15 SPSS, Kaena Point,

00:06:05,492 --> 00:06:08,392 [Speaker 5]
and now at Space Force's INDOPACOM,

00:06:08,452 --> 00:06:09,932 [Speaker 5]
InterPacific, supporting

00:06:10,652 --> 00:06:14,162 [Speaker 5]
the 15 SPSS in that role. So, um, mahalo

00:06:14,252 --> 00:06:16,992 [Speaker 5]
for letting me be here and appreciate it.

00:06:17,052 --> 00:06:18,872 [Speaker 6]
Try that one.

00:06:18,932 --> 00:06:20,792 [Speaker 5]
Aloha, everyone. Can you hear me?

00:06:21,532 --> 00:06:22,472 [Speaker 7]
[laughing]

00:06:22,512 --> 00:06:24,932 [Speaker 6]
Sorry, I thought that might be better.

00:06:26,152 --> 00:06:28,572 [Speaker 5]
Um, that-- No, that, that's all I had to

00:06:28,592 --> 00:06:29,832 [Speaker 5]
share. Thank you.

00:06:29,852 --> 00:06:31,462 [Speaker 6]
[clapping] Mahalo.

00:06:33,572 --> 00:06:37,252 [Speaker 6]
[clapping] Okay, so we have some questions

00:06:37,312 --> 00:06:40,452 [Speaker 6]
that we've, um, presented, and

00:06:40,512 --> 00:06:43,512 [Speaker 6]
we have our folks here who will ask

00:06:43,592 --> 00:06:45,672 [Speaker 6]
follow-up questions or ask for

00:06:45,692 --> 00:06:50,062 [Speaker 6]
clarification. So our first question, um,

00:06:50,152 --> 00:06:52,072 [Speaker 6]
is what specific

00:06:52,132 --> 00:06:54,932 [Speaker 6]
expanded military capabilities would the

00:06:54,992 --> 00:06:58,152 [Speaker 6]
AMIS Star telescope provide? And would

00:06:58,232 --> 00:07:00,972 [Speaker 6]
those capabilities increase Hawaii's

00:07:01,012 --> 00:07:04,232 [Speaker 6]
strategic value as a military asset and

00:07:04,312 --> 00:07:09,072 [Speaker 6]
therefore its vulnerability as a target in

00:07:09,172 --> 00:07:11,132 [Speaker 6]
war since we are at war

00:07:11,572 --> 00:07:14,652 [Speaker 6]
in a number of places around the world?

00:07:14,712 --> 00:07:15,632 [Speaker 6]
So...

00:07:16,602 --> 00:07:21,072 [Speaker 1]
Thank you. So first, I wanna a-address,

00:07:21,152 --> 00:07:24,152 [Speaker 1]
uh, Hawaii being a vulnerability as a

00:07:24,192 --> 00:07:25,992 [Speaker 1]
target of war. So the heart of this

00:07:26,032 --> 00:07:27,922 [Speaker 1]
question, I understand the fear and the

00:07:27,992 --> 00:07:30,432 [Speaker 1]
military presence that can make a location

00:07:30,452 --> 00:07:31,072 [Speaker 1]
a target,

00:07:31,792 --> 00:07:33,712 [Speaker 1]
and we take that seriously. It's important

00:07:33,752 --> 00:07:35,342 [Speaker 1]
to clarify our site's mission.

00:07:36,092 --> 00:07:38,772 [Speaker 1]
We're not here about directing weapons.

00:07:38,812 --> 00:07:40,232 [Speaker 1]
Our purpose is to watch and protect

00:07:40,292 --> 00:07:43,272 [Speaker 1]
objects in space. This capability serves

00:07:43,332 --> 00:07:45,192 [Speaker 1]
as a power deterrent across the world,

00:07:45,212 --> 00:07:47,072 [Speaker 1]
making conflict less likely to extend in

00:07:47,212 --> 00:07:49,692 [Speaker 1]
space. By ensuring the stability of the

00:07:49,772 --> 00:07:51,372 [Speaker 1]
space environment, we protect global

00:07:51,472 --> 00:07:54,392 [Speaker 1]
systems essential for economic and social

00:07:54,432 --> 00:07:55,812 [Speaker 1]
stability for all nations.

00:07:56,592 --> 00:07:59,202 [Speaker 1]
We believe this is-- We believe this

00:07:59,232 --> 00:08:01,452 [Speaker 1]
defensive mission contributes more to the

00:08:01,492 --> 00:08:04,432 [Speaker 1]
safety of Hawaii by deterring conflict

00:08:04,442 --> 00:08:07,892 [Speaker 1]
than it does creating risk. Now, to

00:08:07,932 --> 00:08:10,572 [Speaker 1]
address the specific expanded military

00:08:10,612 --> 00:08:14,172 [Speaker 1]
capabilities, first, I wanna go over real

00:08:14,212 --> 00:08:16,612 [Speaker 1]
quickly what we do on the summit. So our

00:08:16,672 --> 00:08:18,492 [Speaker 1]
sensors provide what we call space domain

00:08:18,532 --> 00:08:22,512 [Speaker 1]
awareness. I relate this to how the FAA

00:08:22,532 --> 00:08:25,212 [Speaker 1]
tracks all the aircraft that traverses the

00:08:25,352 --> 00:08:27,692 [Speaker 1]
sky, and they wanna make sure they know

00:08:27,732 --> 00:08:30,092 [Speaker 1]
where every aircraft is, where it's going,

00:08:30,132 --> 00:08:32,032 [Speaker 1]
and make sure they have a full scope of

00:08:32,052 --> 00:08:33,992 [Speaker 1]
what's going on in the sky. We provide

00:08:34,032 --> 00:08:36,192 [Speaker 1]
that same picture for the Space Force.

00:08:37,692 --> 00:08:39,812 [Speaker 1]
We collect data and information to find

00:08:39,852 --> 00:08:42,092 [Speaker 1]
and track and characterize satellites so

00:08:42,152 --> 00:08:43,732 [Speaker 1]
that we have a better idea of what's going

00:08:43,792 --> 00:08:45,932 [Speaker 1]
on, and we can protect our crucial space

00:08:45,972 --> 00:08:48,972 [Speaker 1]
infrastructure. We do this not just for

00:08:48,992 --> 00:08:50,392 [Speaker 1]
military satellites, but also for

00:08:50,432 --> 00:08:52,772 [Speaker 1]
commercial and civil space. In fact, we

00:08:52,812 --> 00:08:54,442 [Speaker 1]
are currently planning on how we can

00:08:54,492 --> 00:08:59,842 [Speaker 1]
support NASA's first man or, uh, next man

00:08:59,912 --> 00:09:01,302 [Speaker 1]
space flight around the Moon,

00:09:01,332 --> 00:09:04,332 [Speaker 1]
Artemis II, next month. With the current

00:09:04,342 --> 00:09:07,132 [Speaker 1]
set of sensors that we have on the summit,

00:09:07,142 --> 00:09:09,222 [Speaker 1]
they are fully utilized both in time and

00:09:09,272 --> 00:09:12,212 [Speaker 1]
in their current capabilities. Also, we

00:09:12,252 --> 00:09:14,252 [Speaker 1]
have fully utilized the real estate that

00:09:14,261 --> 00:09:16,912 [Speaker 1]
has been afforded us at this point.

00:09:16,952 --> 00:09:19,032 [Speaker 1]
Consequentially, space has become a

00:09:19,052 --> 00:09:21,932 [Speaker 1]
contested and congested domain, contested

00:09:21,972 --> 00:09:23,992 [Speaker 1]
with the new on-orbit threats that our

00:09:24,012 --> 00:09:25,902 [Speaker 1]
adversaries are putting into space, and

00:09:25,952 --> 00:09:27,792 [Speaker 1]
contested by the pure number of space

00:09:27,912 --> 00:09:30,752 [Speaker 1]
objects to track and characterize. Over a

00:09:30,812 --> 00:09:32,832 [Speaker 1]
decade ago, we had only a few thousand

00:09:32,912 --> 00:09:33,952 [Speaker 1]
objects to track

00:09:34,612 --> 00:09:37,332 [Speaker 1]
in space, but now today we have almost

00:09:37,372 --> 00:09:39,872 [Speaker 1]
fifty thousand objects to track. To be

00:09:39,892 --> 00:09:41,612 [Speaker 1]
able to maintain with this growing pace of

00:09:41,632 --> 00:09:44,782 [Speaker 1]
demand, we need to be able to, uh,

00:09:44,812 --> 00:09:48,272 [Speaker 1]
provide the following systems. So of the

00:09:48,292 --> 00:09:50,532 [Speaker 1]
seven telescopes, a couple of them will be

00:09:50,572 --> 00:09:52,952 [Speaker 1]
there to provide testing and range safety

00:09:52,972 --> 00:09:56,362 [Speaker 1]
for, uh, on-orbit satellites. A couple-

00:09:56,372 --> 00:09:57,592 [Speaker 6]
Sorry, can you say that one more time?

00:09:57,652 --> 00:09:59,102 [Speaker 6]
Testing and...

00:09:59,152 --> 00:09:59,782 [Speaker 1]
Range safety

00:10:01,952 --> 00:10:02,772 [Speaker 1]
for on-orbit

00:10:03,472 --> 00:10:04,062 [Speaker 1]
satellites.

00:10:04,112 --> 00:10:05,332 [Speaker 6]
On-orbit?

00:10:05,512 --> 00:10:06,192 [Speaker 1]
Satellites on orbit.

00:10:06,201 --> 00:10:07,932 [Speaker 6]
Okay. Sorry, I just, I missed that part.

00:10:07,972 --> 00:10:08,552 [Speaker 1]
That's fine.

00:10:10,132 --> 00:10:11,992 [Speaker 1]
A couple of sensors to get after the

00:10:12,592 --> 00:10:14,932 [Speaker 1]
problem of our adversaries trying to hide

00:10:14,972 --> 00:10:17,312 [Speaker 1]
from us on orbit. Another sensor to figure

00:10:17,372 --> 00:10:19,792 [Speaker 1]
out how to extend sensor operations into

00:10:19,831 --> 00:10:22,132 [Speaker 1]
daytime. A laser communication ground

00:10:22,192 --> 00:10:24,172 [Speaker 1]
terminal, so basically a satellite using

00:10:24,192 --> 00:10:25,432 [Speaker 1]
laser light to communicate with the

00:10:25,452 --> 00:10:27,132 [Speaker 1]
ground, to meet the rising space

00:10:27,192 --> 00:10:29,652 [Speaker 1]
communication demands for the new on-orbit

00:10:29,712 --> 00:10:32,482 [Speaker 1]
systems. And a LiDAR system, basically a

00:10:32,512 --> 00:10:34,812 [Speaker 1]
radar that uses, uh, laser light

00:10:35,692 --> 00:10:37,512 [Speaker 1]
as its signal, to be able to track

00:10:37,552 --> 00:10:40,042 [Speaker 1]
satellites with high accuracy, not just in

00:10:40,072 --> 00:10:42,112 [Speaker 1]
two-dimensional space, but to add range

00:10:42,152 --> 00:10:44,252 [Speaker 1]
for a third dimension. And all of this is

00:10:44,332 --> 00:10:46,712 [Speaker 1]
in the EIS.

00:10:48,472 --> 00:10:51,512 [Speaker 7]
Um, I have a follow-up question for the

00:10:51,552 --> 00:10:53,132 [Speaker 7]
thing about satellites, tracking

00:10:53,142 --> 00:10:55,872 [Speaker 7]
satellites specifically. Um, what I

00:10:55,932 --> 00:10:58,612 [Speaker 7]
understand at the moment is that a lot of

00:10:58,652 --> 00:11:01,512 [Speaker 7]
satellites that are being put up, a lot of

00:11:01,532 --> 00:11:02,992 [Speaker 7]
them are used for surveillance.

00:11:03,002 --> 00:11:05,452 [Speaker 7]
[clears throat] So if a satellite comes

00:11:05,492 --> 00:11:07,922 [Speaker 7]
into a space, and you guys can see from

00:11:07,952 --> 00:11:10,032 [Speaker 7]
the telescope that it's not a friendly

00:11:10,072 --> 00:11:14,752 [Speaker 7]
satellite, um, would any of these-- would

00:11:14,892 --> 00:11:16,752 [Speaker 7]
any of the things that you wanna put up

00:11:18,052 --> 00:11:21,592 [Speaker 7]
then want to take that satellite down,

00:11:21,672 --> 00:11:24,472 [Speaker 7]
shoot it out of space, interrupt it,

00:11:24,492 --> 00:11:27,252 [Speaker 7]
anything like that? Like, if you-- 'cause

00:11:27,292 --> 00:11:28,672 [Speaker 7]
you're gonna be tracking all of these

00:11:28,752 --> 00:11:31,162 [Speaker 7]
objects, so many objects, right? The ones

00:11:31,212 --> 00:11:33,692 [Speaker 7]
that are not friendly, wi-will you be

00:11:34,952 --> 00:11:37,392 [Speaker 7]
doing things to them from there? Would you

00:11:37,432 --> 00:11:38,952 [Speaker 7]
be?

00:11:38,992 --> 00:11:39,552 [Speaker 1]
From Haleakalā?

00:11:39,612 --> 00:11:40,792 [Speaker 7]
Using these telescopes.

00:11:40,852 --> 00:11:43,412 [Speaker 1]
No. We're just sur-- We're a surveillance

00:11:43,452 --> 00:11:45,312 [Speaker 1]
squadron that provi-provides surveillance

00:11:45,322 --> 00:11:45,322 [Speaker 1]
for space.

00:11:45,392 --> 00:11:47,172 [Speaker 7]
So what, what happens then when you find

00:11:47,232 --> 00:11:49,792 [Speaker 7]
something that, in the sky that is not a

00:11:49,852 --> 00:11:52,532 [Speaker 7]
friendly object that you categorize? If

00:11:52,552 --> 00:11:54,582 [Speaker 7]
you're looking from-- If you were to have

00:11:54,612 --> 00:11:56,162 [Speaker 7]
a telescope up there that is tracking

00:11:56,172 --> 00:11:58,452 [Speaker 7]
these objects and you pick up on some

00:11:58,512 --> 00:12:00,692 [Speaker 7]
objects that you didn't like, what happens

00:12:00,752 --> 00:12:01,971 [Speaker 7]
then?

00:12:07,004 --> 00:12:08,564 [Speaker 1]
So we have our command chains where we

00:12:08,584 --> 00:12:10,574 [Speaker 1]
report our findings, and then they

00:12:10,604 --> 00:12:11,714 [Speaker 1]
communicate with other satellite

00:12:11,804 --> 00:12:14,004 [Speaker 1]
operators, and they perform whatever they

00:12:14,104 --> 00:12:15,244 [Speaker 1]
think they need to do for the health and

00:12:15,324 --> 00:12:16,904 [Speaker 1]
safety of their own space vehicles.

00:12:17,724 --> 00:12:20,284 [Speaker 7]
Okay, so say they wanted to remove that

00:12:20,324 --> 00:12:24,144 [Speaker 7]
satellite from the space. That would not

00:12:24,184 --> 00:12:25,984 [Speaker 7]
happen from Haleakalā. You would give

00:12:26,044 --> 00:12:28,324 [Speaker 7]
that, the, the information to somebody

00:12:28,384 --> 00:12:29,884 [Speaker 7]
else, and they would be involved in

00:12:29,924 --> 00:12:32,444 [Speaker 7]
removing that satellite from the near

00:12:32,724 --> 00:12:35,484 [Speaker 7]
Earth orbit.

00:12:36,704 --> 00:12:37,084 [Speaker 1]
Y-yes.

00:12:37,824 --> 00:12:39,754 [Speaker 1]
We're a space surveillance squadron. Uh,

00:12:39,784 --> 00:12:42,414 [Speaker 1]
we just collect data and information, and

00:12:42,424 --> 00:12:43,764 [Speaker 1]
then we report it up through our command

00:12:43,824 --> 00:12:44,334 [Speaker 1]
chains.

00:12:46,484 --> 00:12:48,103 [Speaker 7]
Okay, thank you.

00:12:48,524 --> 00:12:50,804 [Speaker 8]
Any other question?

00:12:50,844 --> 00:12:53,504 [Speaker 9]
I'm s-- Just, just to follow up on that,

00:12:54,624 --> 00:12:56,544 [Speaker 9]
I'm hearing you say that they would not

00:12:56,644 --> 00:12:58,424 [Speaker 9]
shoot from Haleakalā. Is that what you

00:12:58,464 --> 00:12:59,664 [Speaker 9]
said?

00:12:59,744 --> 00:13:00,284 [Speaker 1]
No.

00:13:00,344 --> 00:13:01,784 [Speaker 9]
Okay, but how about Kihei?

00:13:02,424 --> 00:13:02,604 [Speaker 1]
No.

00:13:02,644 --> 00:13:04,664 [Speaker 9]
Are there any lasers or things that they'd

00:13:04,704 --> 00:13:06,764 [Speaker 9]
be coordinating and-

00:13:06,824 --> 00:13:10,664 [Speaker 1]
No, ma'am. Nothing here on island.

00:13:12,283 --> 00:13:14,264 [Speaker 10]
Just a quick follow-up question.

00:13:14,284 --> 00:13:16,184 [Speaker 10]
[clears throat] So

00:13:17,084 --> 00:13:19,084 [Speaker 10]
the actual military strike may not come

00:13:19,124 --> 00:13:20,964 [Speaker 10]
from Haleakalā or Kihei, but may I ask

00:13:20,984 --> 00:13:24,144 [Speaker 10]
this question? Can that information be

00:13:24,344 --> 00:13:24,884 [Speaker 10]
used

00:13:26,944 --> 00:13:30,334 [Speaker 10]
in military exercises, actual military

00:13:30,564 --> 00:13:32,934 [Speaker 10]
events, um,

00:13:34,004 --> 00:13:36,224 [Speaker 10]
in other parts of the world?

00:13:37,804 --> 00:13:39,984 [Speaker 10]
In other words, I'm, I'm, as a indigenous

00:13:40,024 --> 00:13:42,324 [Speaker 10]
native Kanaka of this land, I am very

00:13:42,364 --> 00:13:43,964 [Speaker 10]
concerned that that information will be

00:13:44,064 --> 00:13:45,394 [Speaker 10]
used upon other

00:13:46,744 --> 00:13:48,244 [Speaker 10]
so-called native peoples like indigenous

00:13:48,304 --> 00:13:50,064 [Speaker 10]
Palestinians in Gaza. So I'm just

00:13:50,104 --> 00:13:51,384 [Speaker 10]
concerned, and I'm wondering. So I know

00:13:51,424 --> 00:13:53,464 [Speaker 10]
you're saying as if your hands are clean

00:13:53,524 --> 00:13:56,844 [Speaker 10]
here, so I'm just wondering, can you, can

00:13:56,944 --> 00:13:59,684 [Speaker 10]
you say, can you say that the information

00:13:59,724 --> 00:14:01,944 [Speaker 10]
will not be used against indigenous

00:14:01,984 --> 00:14:03,424 [Speaker 10]
peoples around the world in a military

00:14:03,464 --> 00:14:05,264 [Speaker 10]
campaign?

00:14:07,264 --> 00:14:08,964 [Speaker 1]
So I think the information that we collect

00:14:09,004 --> 00:14:11,484 [Speaker 1]
and provide our senior leaders is

00:14:11,504 --> 00:14:14,024 [Speaker 1]
critical, so that way they can make the

00:14:14,704 --> 00:14:16,684 [Speaker 1]
most informed decision that they can to

00:14:16,704 --> 00:14:18,484 [Speaker 1]
protect our national security here.

00:14:18,504 --> 00:14:20,244 [Speaker 10]
But my que-- Let me ask my question again

00:14:20,284 --> 00:14:20,733 [Speaker 10]
one more time.

00:14:21,724 --> 00:14:22,724 [Speaker 10]
Let me ask this question. I'll be clear

00:14:22,764 --> 00:14:25,904 [Speaker 10]
about this. Can this information gathered

00:14:25,944 --> 00:14:26,784 [Speaker 10]
in surveillance

00:14:27,464 --> 00:14:28,984 [Speaker 10]
that you propose on Haleakalā with these

00:14:29,044 --> 00:14:33,484 [Speaker 10]
new AMOS-6 telescopes, can it be used? I

00:14:33,524 --> 00:14:35,104 [Speaker 10]
mean, you may not know, Hari, but can it

00:14:35,184 --> 00:14:37,584 [Speaker 10]
be used by the U.S. military specifically

00:14:37,644 --> 00:14:40,164 [Speaker 10]
against native peoples and indigenous

00:14:40,184 --> 00:14:43,324 [Speaker 10]
peoples around the world, such as the

00:14:43,344 --> 00:14:46,464 [Speaker 10]
Palestinian native peoples of Gaza?

00:14:50,324 --> 00:14:51,244 [Speaker 3]
Tic Chong.

00:14:52,864 --> 00:14:54,444 [Speaker 3]
I will be honest, and I will say I do not

00:14:54,524 --> 00:14:57,404 [Speaker 3]
know that answer, okay? Uh,

00:14:58,104 --> 00:14:58,904 [Speaker 3]
we will provide

00:14:59,544 --> 00:15:01,464 [Speaker 3]
that information, that early warning,

00:15:01,504 --> 00:15:02,554 [Speaker 3]
that, that

00:15:04,244 --> 00:15:07,684 [Speaker 3]
cue to the other parts. Our mission set,

00:15:07,724 --> 00:15:10,384 [Speaker 3]
again, space domain awareness. We maintain

00:15:10,424 --> 00:15:13,244 [Speaker 3]
custody. We do characterization. Good

00:15:13,304 --> 00:15:16,824 [Speaker 3]
guy, not good guy. I don't know. That guy

00:15:16,924 --> 00:15:19,684 [Speaker 3]
just showed up, and we have no idea. We

00:15:19,704 --> 00:15:21,624 [Speaker 3]
need to figure out what that is. Why is

00:15:21,684 --> 00:15:22,164 [Speaker 3]
that guy

00:15:22,764 --> 00:15:26,464 [Speaker 3]
moving next to our guy? And then something

00:15:26,504 --> 00:15:28,614 [Speaker 3]
goes boop like this and goes doot, doot,

00:15:28,614 --> 00:15:30,114 [Speaker 3]
doot like that. It's like, that's bad.

00:15:31,004 --> 00:15:31,194 [Speaker 3]
Um,

00:15:31,864 --> 00:15:35,513 [Speaker 3]
so we don't... I cannot answer, and I

00:15:35,524 --> 00:15:36,904 [Speaker 3]
don't think any of us here can answer

00:15:36,944 --> 00:15:38,013 [Speaker 3]
that. Uh,

00:15:38,764 --> 00:15:40,864 [Speaker 3]
but we will provide as much data as

00:15:40,924 --> 00:15:44,484 [Speaker 3]
possible to the Air and Space Force and

00:15:44,564 --> 00:15:47,884 [Speaker 3]
all of Department of War, so we can

00:15:47,924 --> 00:15:48,424 [Speaker 3]
provide

00:15:49,064 --> 00:15:50,784 [Speaker 3]
the best capability to protect

00:15:51,564 --> 00:15:54,354 [Speaker 3]
the people of this nation.

00:15:56,304 --> 00:16:00,184 [Speaker 7]
Um, can I ask, how many other outfits are

00:16:00,244 --> 00:16:02,524 [Speaker 7]
there like this in the Space Force? Are

00:16:02,544 --> 00:16:04,904 [Speaker 7]
there other outfits in other parts of the

00:16:04,944 --> 00:16:07,974 [Speaker 7]
world that already do what you guys are

00:16:08,004 --> 00:16:09,404 [Speaker 7]
talking about?

00:16:09,504 --> 00:16:11,744 [Speaker 1]
Space surveillance?

00:16:11,824 --> 00:16:13,733 [Speaker 7]
Yeah. The things that you just described-

00:16:13,764 --> 00:16:13,964 [Speaker 1]
Yeah.

00:16:13,974 --> 00:16:15,554 [Speaker 7]
-that you would want to do at Haleakalā.

00:16:15,584 --> 00:16:17,214 [Speaker 7]
Are there other people already doing those

00:16:17,244 --> 00:16:20,164 [Speaker 7]
in other parts of the world?

00:16:20,264 --> 00:16:22,484 [Speaker 1]
S-so we, so we fall under, uh, Mission

00:16:22,544 --> 00:16:24,803 [Speaker 1]
Delta Two that owns the whole space domain

00:16:24,844 --> 00:16:26,274 [Speaker 1]
awareness mission set for the Space

00:16:26,363 --> 00:16:28,164 [Speaker 1]
Force. There are only two space

00:16:28,184 --> 00:16:29,964 [Speaker 1]
surveillance squadrons. We are one of

00:16:30,024 --> 00:16:32,164 [Speaker 1]
them. The other is the Twentieth. They

00:16:32,204 --> 00:16:35,204 [Speaker 1]
primarily, uh, own and run the radar

00:16:35,244 --> 00:16:38,824 [Speaker 1]
systems that can also do tracking. So they

00:16:38,844 --> 00:16:40,254 [Speaker 1]
can provide a, a different set of

00:16:40,284 --> 00:16:42,944 [Speaker 1]
capability for tracking, uh, satellites

00:16:42,984 --> 00:16:44,744 [Speaker 1]
with radars, whereas we use

00:16:44,784 --> 00:16:46,764 [Speaker 1]
electro-optical systems, the telescopes,

00:16:46,784 --> 00:16:49,044 [Speaker 1]
in order to do the tracking. And together

00:16:49,064 --> 00:16:51,924 [Speaker 1]
they provide, uh, a better full picture

00:16:51,964 --> 00:16:53,584 [Speaker 1]
for the Space Force as far as what's on

00:16:53,624 --> 00:16:55,364 [Speaker 1]
the orbit, 'cause the different ones have

00:16:55,384 --> 00:16:56,464 [Speaker 1]
different capabilities.

00:16:57,964 --> 00:17:00,824 [Speaker 7]
Thank you for clarifying, because I do,

00:17:02,024 --> 00:17:04,264 [Speaker 7]
like Kaleikoi, share concerns. You know,

00:17:05,184 --> 00:17:06,964 [Speaker 7]
what's happening in Iran right now,

00:17:07,864 --> 00:17:11,474 [Speaker 7]
they're-- even though they're not, um...

00:17:11,504 --> 00:17:12,844 [Speaker 7]
You know, a lot of the places that are

00:17:12,884 --> 00:17:15,584 [Speaker 7]
doing exactly what you're talking about,

00:17:15,594 --> 00:17:17,894 [Speaker 7]
they are getting hit because they have

00:17:17,904 --> 00:17:19,764 [Speaker 7]
surveillance capability, because they are

00:17:19,804 --> 00:17:23,164 [Speaker 7]
watching, right? And when a war

00:17:23,324 --> 00:17:26,694 [Speaker 7]
happens, the adversaries wanna take out

00:17:26,984 --> 00:17:30,294 [Speaker 7]
the ability of whoever, you know,

00:17:30,364 --> 00:17:33,264 [Speaker 7]
i-is their, their opponent to be able to

00:17:33,324 --> 00:17:37,104 [Speaker 7]
see, to be able to track. So again,

00:17:37,964 --> 00:17:40,564 [Speaker 7]
I-- it's hard for me to think that it

00:17:40,624 --> 00:17:41,084 [Speaker 7]
doesn't

00:17:42,084 --> 00:17:46,144 [Speaker 7]
pose a vulner-a vulnerability.

00:17:48,504 --> 00:17:50,424 [Speaker 9]
Okay, probably we gotta go to question

00:17:50,504 --> 00:17:50,824 [Speaker 9]
two, uh-

00:17:50,844 --> 00:17:54,944 [Speaker 8]
Yeah. We're gonna move on to question two,

00:17:55,004 --> 00:17:57,604 [Speaker 8]
and this has to do with, um, the

00:17:57,724 --> 00:17:58,784 [Speaker 8]
fact that I think

00:17:59,584 --> 00:18:02,744 [Speaker 8]
the military... I mean, it was the case

00:18:02,784 --> 00:18:04,544 [Speaker 8]
with the DCIST, and I think it's the case

00:18:04,684 --> 00:18:07,344 [Speaker 8]
here with AMOS-Star, that they try to

00:18:07,424 --> 00:18:09,124 [Speaker 8]
separate out all these

00:18:11,072 --> 00:18:14,392 [Speaker 6]
All these projects, right? So how has the

00:18:14,432 --> 00:18:16,952 [Speaker 6]
military evaluated the cumulative

00:18:16,992 --> 00:18:19,092 [Speaker 6]
environmental impacts on the summit of

00:18:19,112 --> 00:18:21,762 [Speaker 6]
Haleakalā resulting from decades of

00:18:21,832 --> 00:18:24,772 [Speaker 6]
military activity, telescope development,

00:18:24,852 --> 00:18:28,072 [Speaker 6]
academic use, road access, utility

00:18:28,152 --> 00:18:31,172 [Speaker 6]
infrastructure, and public visitation,

00:18:31,212 --> 00:18:34,132 [Speaker 6]
rather than limiting analysis only to the

00:18:34,192 --> 00:18:36,512 [Speaker 6]
footprint of this single project, this

00:18:36,612 --> 00:18:37,012 [Speaker 6]
little

00:18:37,652 --> 00:18:41,472 [Speaker 6]
piece of the larger Science City? What

00:18:41,482 --> 00:18:44,492 [Speaker 6]
summit-wide protective measures are

00:18:44,532 --> 00:18:47,712 [Speaker 6]
being planned to address the total burden

00:18:48,632 --> 00:18:51,992 [Speaker 6]
already placed on this fragile environment

00:18:52,792 --> 00:18:55,422 [Speaker 6]
and will be exacerbated with this

00:18:55,492 --> 00:18:58,532 [Speaker 6]
additional project?

00:19:00,632 --> 00:19:02,012 [Speaker 4]
All right, I'll, I'll take this question.

00:19:02,052 --> 00:19:05,132 [Speaker 4]
Uh, yes, this works. Um, [clears throat]

00:19:05,172 --> 00:19:05,692 [Speaker 4]
okay, so

00:19:06,532 --> 00:19:07,972 [Speaker 4]
you guys have a lot of passion. I

00:19:08,012 --> 00:19:10,632 [Speaker 4]
appreciate it. Um, coming here and, and

00:19:10,752 --> 00:19:12,412 [Speaker 4]
learning about the passions between the

00:19:12,432 --> 00:19:13,332 [Speaker 4]
three organizations

00:19:13,972 --> 00:19:18,202 [Speaker 4]
actually is, um, something I didn't know

00:19:18,252 --> 00:19:19,652 [Speaker 4]
even growing up from here. So thank, thank

00:19:19,672 --> 00:19:20,932 [Speaker 4]
you for that. Um,

00:19:21,552 --> 00:19:24,112 [Speaker 4]
a part of this process is us, the Space

00:19:24,192 --> 00:19:28,532 [Speaker 4]
Force, is, um, bounded by this framework.

00:19:28,572 --> 00:19:30,732 [Speaker 4]
Regardless of what we think about, we are

00:19:30,752 --> 00:19:32,392 [Speaker 4]
bounded by this framework, so we have to

00:19:32,452 --> 00:19:34,952 [Speaker 4]
operate within, within the box given by

00:19:35,032 --> 00:19:37,092 [Speaker 4]
the federal government. So

00:19:38,312 --> 00:19:40,912 [Speaker 4]
the NEPA process, which includes the EIS,

00:19:41,032 --> 00:19:43,942 [Speaker 4]
is a federally mandated process as, um, as

00:19:44,072 --> 00:19:47,632 [Speaker 4]
stated by, uh, by Ms. Kaliipi. The EIS

00:19:47,712 --> 00:19:49,982 [Speaker 4]
does include analysis, uh, beyond its

00:19:50,092 --> 00:19:52,652 [Speaker 4]
footprint. So page three dash three, uh,

00:19:52,732 --> 00:19:55,922 [Speaker 4]
analyzes combined effects. Um, these,

00:19:55,952 --> 00:19:58,272 [Speaker 4]
these combined effects analyze the

00:19:58,292 --> 00:19:59,952 [Speaker 4]
incremental effect of a project in

00:19:59,992 --> 00:20:02,592 [Speaker 4]
combination with past, present, and

00:20:02,632 --> 00:20:05,752 [Speaker 4]
reasonably foreseeable future events. So

00:20:05,792 --> 00:20:08,992 [Speaker 4]
we're looking at, um, Department of the

00:20:09,052 --> 00:20:11,972 [Speaker 4]
Air Force, Air Force, Space Force, FAA,

00:20:12,092 --> 00:20:15,552 [Speaker 4]
um, National Park Service, and, um, UH. So

00:20:15,612 --> 00:20:18,672 [Speaker 4]
it did look into, um, not just us, but

00:20:18,752 --> 00:20:20,792 [Speaker 4]
also expanding on just the

00:20:21,872 --> 00:20:27,852 [Speaker 4]
single footprint of this project.

00:20:30,372 --> 00:20:32,312 [Speaker 4]
So to address those, those six there,

00:20:32,352 --> 00:20:33,692 [Speaker 4]
right? We're looking at the, the latter

00:20:33,932 --> 00:20:36,432 [Speaker 4]
four, academic use, road access, utility

00:20:36,472 --> 00:20:39,322 [Speaker 4]
infrastructure, and public visitation. Um,

00:20:40,232 --> 00:20:41,812 [Speaker 4]
this one's really tough for, for the

00:20:41,872 --> 00:20:45,082 [Speaker 4]
military to kind of own it, uh, because

00:20:45,132 --> 00:20:48,502 [Speaker 4]
it, it takes more than just us, um, to

00:20:48,532 --> 00:20:49,762 [Speaker 4]
address these issues. We have

00:20:49,792 --> 00:20:53,192 [Speaker 4]
organizations, the NPS controls access,

00:20:53,272 --> 00:20:55,972 [Speaker 4]
um, to the summit. Um, we have HECO

00:20:56,252 --> 00:20:58,192 [Speaker 4]
providing us utilities, Hawaiian Telecom

00:20:58,252 --> 00:21:02,892 [Speaker 4]
providing us the comms, um, the county,

00:21:02,932 --> 00:21:04,452 [Speaker 4]
Hawaiian Tourism Authority also

00:21:04,492 --> 00:21:07,512 [Speaker 4]
controlling, um, the tourism, the public

00:21:07,572 --> 00:21:10,012 [Speaker 4]
visitation up there. So that one, that one

00:21:10,032 --> 00:21:12,632 [Speaker 4]
is tough for us to own. Um, but what I

00:21:12,672 --> 00:21:13,712 [Speaker 4]
can speak on

00:21:14,972 --> 00:21:18,392 [Speaker 4]
more clearly is the, um, military activity

00:21:18,552 --> 00:21:21,482 [Speaker 4]
and telescope development. So these two

00:21:21,772 --> 00:21:25,292 [Speaker 4]
go hand in hand as, um, what my commander

00:21:25,332 --> 00:21:28,752 [Speaker 4]
just mentioned, uh, why the, why we

00:21:28,772 --> 00:21:31,072 [Speaker 4]
need the Space Force, and it's highlighted

00:21:31,132 --> 00:21:34,432 [Speaker 4]
by, um, the, the Star Project.

00:21:36,152 --> 00:21:36,512 [Speaker 4]
To

00:21:38,152 --> 00:21:40,012 [Speaker 4]
minimize impact, um,

00:21:40,652 --> 00:21:43,712 [Speaker 4]
we're trying to use land, um, authorized

00:21:43,732 --> 00:21:45,932 [Speaker 4]
by Governor Quinn back in 'fifty-seven,

00:21:45,992 --> 00:21:48,012 [Speaker 4]
right? Executive Order eighteen oh eight.

00:21:48,092 --> 00:21:50,062 [Speaker 4]
Uh, that is, that is one way, not asking

00:21:50,132 --> 00:21:53,172 [Speaker 4]
for additional land up there. Uh,

00:21:55,232 --> 00:21:57,752 [Speaker 4]
additionally, looking at the geopolitics

00:21:57,832 --> 00:22:00,772 [Speaker 4]
and technolo- technological advances will

00:22:00,852 --> 00:22:03,412 [Speaker 4]
be key factors in looking at the, the

00:22:03,492 --> 00:22:05,252 [Speaker 4]
military activity and, and telescope

00:22:05,292 --> 00:22:07,052 [Speaker 4]
adva-- um, development. So

00:22:08,092 --> 00:22:10,961 [Speaker 4]
the military here, we have a duty, um,

00:22:10,992 --> 00:22:14,042 [Speaker 4]
towards national security. Um, that's what

00:22:14,072 --> 00:22:16,982 [Speaker 4]
we signed up for. We volunteered to do

00:22:17,032 --> 00:22:19,762 [Speaker 4]
this. No one told us to do this. Um, and

00:22:19,892 --> 00:22:22,452 [Speaker 4]
as the world is now, there's a need for

00:22:22,492 --> 00:22:24,901 [Speaker 4]
the Star Project, but no one knows what

00:22:24,932 --> 00:22:28,152 [Speaker 4]
the world would look like in the future.

00:22:28,162 --> 00:22:30,232 [Speaker 4]
[clears throat] We cannot for certain

00:22:30,412 --> 00:22:33,392 [Speaker 4]
predict what our presence looks like on

00:22:33,432 --> 00:22:36,942 [Speaker 4]
Haleakalā ten, fifty, two hundred, a

00:22:37,052 --> 00:22:40,552 [Speaker 4]
thousand years from now. [clears throat]

00:22:40,562 --> 00:22:43,212 [Speaker 4]
Will space be more contested, more

00:22:43,252 --> 00:22:46,422 [Speaker 4]
congested? Absolutely. Countries just like

00:22:46,492 --> 00:22:48,972 [Speaker 4]
us are launching satellites into space

00:22:49,692 --> 00:22:50,302 [Speaker 4]
for their

00:22:51,052 --> 00:22:54,052 [Speaker 4]
security, for their people, for GPS, for

00:22:54,152 --> 00:22:56,712 [Speaker 4]
communications. But does this necessarily

00:22:56,772 --> 00:22:59,672 [Speaker 4]
mean it will be more or less adversarial?

00:22:59,772 --> 00:23:00,432 [Speaker 4]
No one knows.

00:23:01,312 --> 00:23:02,972 [Speaker 4]
Um, and as for technology,

00:23:03,992 --> 00:23:06,012 [Speaker 4]
as we look forward, will the

00:23:06,892 --> 00:23:10,892 [Speaker 4]
quantity of telescopes overcome quality?

00:23:10,972 --> 00:23:13,132 [Speaker 4]
Um, maybe. So we don't know if

00:23:13,212 --> 00:23:16,552 [Speaker 4]
science will allow us to accomplish our

00:23:16,612 --> 00:23:20,212 [Speaker 4]
mission on Haleakalā with fewer but,

00:23:20,272 --> 00:23:21,212 [Speaker 4]
um, more advanced

00:23:21,252 --> 00:23:27,932 [Speaker 4]
telescopes.

00:23:29,232 --> 00:23:33,242 [Speaker 7]
Sorry, this is slightly outside of this

00:23:33,272 --> 00:23:34,922 [Speaker 7]
particular question, but you brought up

00:23:34,972 --> 00:23:36,952 [Speaker 7]
HECO. And

00:23:38,192 --> 00:23:40,252 [Speaker 7]
in looking at the document, which was

00:23:40,292 --> 00:23:42,632 [Speaker 7]
really long, and we didn't have a-- we had

00:23:42,652 --> 00:23:44,652 [Speaker 7]
a really short time to read it, so

00:23:44,692 --> 00:23:45,772 [Speaker 7]
perhaps I missed it.

00:23:46,792 --> 00:23:51,162 [Speaker 7]
It did give an estimated total carbon, um,

00:23:53,332 --> 00:23:55,252 [Speaker 7]
belching into the universe use of carbon

00:23:55,452 --> 00:23:58,052 [Speaker 7]
[chuckles] for the building part and also

00:23:58,092 --> 00:24:01,832 [Speaker 7]
for the normal operations annually. But it

00:24:01,872 --> 00:24:05,082 [Speaker 7]
said nothing about, besides drawing from

00:24:05,112 --> 00:24:07,552 [Speaker 7]
the actual local grid power that you need

00:24:07,612 --> 00:24:09,862 [Speaker 7]
to run the facility, it didn't say what

00:24:09,892 --> 00:24:14,292 [Speaker 7]
kind of load thatThat is. So I'm wondering

00:24:14,692 --> 00:24:16,752 [Speaker 7]
what kind of power load

00:24:16,852 --> 00:24:17,422 [Speaker 7]
and if

00:24:18,192 --> 00:24:20,392 [Speaker 7]
you're required in this process at all to

00:24:20,452 --> 00:24:22,352 [Speaker 7]
indicate how much energy you need

00:24:22,972 --> 00:24:24,142 [Speaker 7]
from this--

00:24:25,072 --> 00:24:27,292 [Speaker 7]
from our local grid.

00:24:29,152 --> 00:24:29,532 [Speaker 11]
So

00:24:30,992 --> 00:24:33,552 [Speaker 11]
we don't know the load that the seven

00:24:33,572 --> 00:24:36,192 [Speaker 11]
telescopes will pull, um, because they

00:24:36,232 --> 00:24:38,032 [Speaker 11]
haven't been designed yet. Um,

00:24:38,952 --> 00:24:41,612 [Speaker 11]
that's, that's the answer to that.

00:24:42,552 --> 00:24:44,632 [Speaker 7]
Thank you for your honesty. Yes, Auntie,

00:24:44,672 --> 00:24:46,932 [Speaker 7]
please.

00:24:48,992 --> 00:24:51,052 [Speaker 12]
You know, if it's in the report, I'm so

00:24:51,112 --> 00:24:54,992 [Speaker 12]
sorry. But is-- because you brought up

00:24:55,232 --> 00:25:00,392 [Speaker 12]
about the time and technology parts,

00:25:01,312 --> 00:25:03,952 [Speaker 12]
is there, uh,

00:25:04,612 --> 00:25:08,192 [Speaker 12]
we power using it now, uh, time to go

00:25:08,332 --> 00:25:09,492 [Speaker 12]
home.

00:25:11,372 --> 00:25:14,912 [Speaker 12]
Twenty years, twenty-five years, we figure

00:25:15,012 --> 00:25:18,312 [Speaker 12]
technology is gonna keep increasing.

00:25:18,412 --> 00:25:20,212 [Speaker 12]
So is there a time

00:25:21,292 --> 00:25:21,852 [Speaker 12]
span

00:25:22,752 --> 00:25:24,972 [Speaker 12]
that though you anticipate

00:25:25,652 --> 00:25:28,192 [Speaker 12]
those telescopes have run of life

00:25:28,892 --> 00:25:32,372 [Speaker 12]
until they're no good anymore?

00:25:34,752 --> 00:25:38,192 [Speaker 11]
Auntie, I hope so, and I hope it's sooner

00:25:39,152 --> 00:25:41,832 [Speaker 11]
rather than later. I don't know the answer

00:25:41,872 --> 00:25:44,442 [Speaker 11]
to that. But I would

00:25:45,432 --> 00:25:48,372 [Speaker 11]
honestly, truly like to say, "No, no need

00:25:48,392 --> 00:25:50,512 [Speaker 11]
already. Let's take it back to how it

00:25:50,552 --> 00:25:53,932 [Speaker 11]
was," sooner rather than later. But we're

00:25:53,972 --> 00:25:56,452 [Speaker 11]
not there right now.

00:25:57,692 --> 00:25:59,872 [Speaker 7]
Um, sorry. And also, I know you referred

00:25:59,932 --> 00:26:01,432 [Speaker 7]
to a certain section of the report where

00:26:01,472 --> 00:26:04,872 [Speaker 7]
you said cumulative impacts are addressed.

00:26:06,792 --> 00:26:09,212 [Speaker 7]
And I c-- how long is that section? 'Cause

00:26:09,352 --> 00:26:11,442 [Speaker 7]
I, w-in reading it, I didn't feel

00:26:11,792 --> 00:26:14,062 [Speaker 7]
[chuckles] like I got a sense of anything

00:26:15,192 --> 00:26:16,832 [Speaker 7]
with a lot of, you know, where-- that I

00:26:16,852 --> 00:26:19,852 [Speaker 7]
could get a lot out of. I, uh,

00:26:20,472 --> 00:26:22,412 [Speaker 7]
there's a lot of like single paragraphs

00:26:22,452 --> 00:26:26,012 [Speaker 7]
that just say, "This is what we think," or

00:26:26,132 --> 00:26:26,512 [Speaker 7]
y-- but

00:26:27,472 --> 00:26:29,872 [Speaker 7]
I didn't get any sense of how you've

00:26:29,932 --> 00:26:30,872 [Speaker 7]
evaluated

00:26:32,932 --> 00:26:33,452 [Speaker 7]
the, like

00:26:34,112 --> 00:26:36,372 [Speaker 7]
we're asking about, the cumulative impact,

00:26:36,432 --> 00:26:40,112 [Speaker 7]
you know. What, what more telescopes on

00:26:40,132 --> 00:26:42,302 [Speaker 7]
the mountain will... We know that they're

00:26:42,332 --> 00:26:44,532 [Speaker 7]
gonna disrupt w-- but what were disrupted

00:26:44,592 --> 00:26:46,572 [Speaker 7]
already, you know. So it isn't just

00:26:47,812 --> 00:26:49,772 [Speaker 7]
the, the new project that we're worrying

00:26:49,832 --> 00:26:51,992 [Speaker 7]
about, it's that-- it's the increase on

00:26:52,032 --> 00:26:53,522 [Speaker 7]
the already heavy load.

00:26:54,172 --> 00:26:56,052 [Speaker 7]
So if you could just direct me back to

00:26:56,092 --> 00:26:57,712 [Speaker 7]
that section, I'd like to reread that at

00:26:57,732 --> 00:26:59,032 [Speaker 7]
some point.

00:26:59,072 --> 00:27:01,392 [Speaker 11]
Absolutely. Uh, three dash th-- page,

00:27:01,452 --> 00:27:03,052 [Speaker 11]
sorry, page three dash three on the

00:27:03,092 --> 00:27:04,052 [Speaker 11]
bottom.

00:27:04,112 --> 00:27:05,052 [Speaker 7]
Three dash-

00:27:05,092 --> 00:27:05,632 [Speaker 11]
Three.

00:27:05,672 --> 00:27:07,632 [Speaker 7]
Three dash three. Okay. I'll have another

00:27:07,652 --> 00:27:09,392 [Speaker 7]
look at that.

00:27:10,472 --> 00:27:12,472 [Speaker 10]
Uh, just to follow up on the ideas of

00:27:12,532 --> 00:27:14,032 [Speaker 10]
cumulative environmental

00:27:15,812 --> 00:27:17,242 [Speaker 10]
questions and damages. I'm gonna say

00:27:17,252 --> 00:27:20,972 [Speaker 10]
damage. What makes the Space Force's

00:27:21,052 --> 00:27:21,992 [Speaker 10]
management plan

00:27:23,572 --> 00:27:26,212 [Speaker 10]
so better or so much an improvement

00:27:27,912 --> 00:27:31,102 [Speaker 10]
in comparison to what had happened at

00:27:31,132 --> 00:27:34,632 [Speaker 10]
Kapukaki, Kaho'olawe,

00:27:34,772 --> 00:27:38,992 [Speaker 10]
um, Pohakuloa? I mean, we can talk about

00:27:39,012 --> 00:27:40,932 [Speaker 10]
the recent diesel spill recently. In other

00:27:40,952 --> 00:27:41,292 [Speaker 10]
words,

00:27:42,932 --> 00:27:44,892 [Speaker 10]
what makes you guys special in regards to

00:27:44,932 --> 00:27:46,012 [Speaker 10]
saying, "You guys are more

00:27:47,152 --> 00:27:48,552 [Speaker 10]
better stewards"? Because

00:27:49,152 --> 00:27:50,501 [Speaker 10]
when I look back, the diesel spill has

00:27:50,572 --> 00:27:53,212 [Speaker 10]
still yet to be resolved. And so I'm just

00:27:53,252 --> 00:27:54,752 [Speaker 10]
wondering, [chuckles] like, you guys

00:27:54,812 --> 00:27:56,262 [Speaker 10]
moving ahead, yet you guys never wiped

00:27:56,312 --> 00:27:58,092 [Speaker 10]
your kole yet. Still stink back there,

00:27:58,152 --> 00:28:00,252 [Speaker 10]
still smell. And you guys still trying to

00:28:00,292 --> 00:28:01,692 [Speaker 10]
move ahead. So I wanna know exactly what

00:28:01,732 --> 00:28:03,781 [Speaker 10]
makes you guys special in regards to this

00:28:03,812 --> 00:28:05,732 [Speaker 10]
management.

00:28:06,012 --> 00:28:09,792 [Speaker 0]
Nothing. I mean, in all, in all honesty,

00:28:09,872 --> 00:28:12,872 [Speaker 0]
it's learning how to do better, right? So

00:28:12,932 --> 00:28:16,382 [Speaker 0]
to be clear, I would agree that there's

00:28:16,432 --> 00:28:19,712 [Speaker 0]
more that needs to be added, that could be

00:28:19,792 --> 00:28:22,642 [Speaker 0]
added for cumulative effect, right? Part

00:28:22,672 --> 00:28:26,052 [Speaker 0]
of the problem, or not problem, part of

00:28:26,092 --> 00:28:28,481 [Speaker 0]
the challenge is

00:28:28,552 --> 00:28:31,421 [Speaker 0]
when you're meeting the statutory

00:28:31,531 --> 00:28:34,382 [Speaker 0]
requirements and you haven't done it yet,

00:28:34,912 --> 00:28:37,082 [Speaker 0]
right? You haven't designed it yet, and

00:28:37,112 --> 00:28:39,612 [Speaker 0]
the requirement is to say, "If you were

00:28:39,652 --> 00:28:42,682 [Speaker 0]
gonna do it, what is the biggest it could

00:28:42,712 --> 00:28:44,522 [Speaker 0]
be? What is the most impact it could be,"

00:28:44,552 --> 00:28:48,332 [Speaker 0]
right? You, you g-- there, there are areas

00:28:48,372 --> 00:28:50,992 [Speaker 0]
that you have to answer,

00:28:51,032 --> 00:28:54,032 [Speaker 0]
right? But this is all pre, right? 'Cause

00:28:54,072 --> 00:28:57,312 [Speaker 0]
this is a before part of doing it.

00:28:57,372 --> 00:29:01,032 [Speaker 0]
So, um, so to answer your question,

00:29:01,072 --> 00:29:03,772 [Speaker 0]
there's a lot the, the-- that has to be

00:29:03,812 --> 00:29:05,512 [Speaker 0]
proven as to whether or not you can. I

00:29:05,532 --> 00:29:08,772 [Speaker 0]
don't think anybody on this side is saying

00:29:08,792 --> 00:29:09,992 [Speaker 0]
they're any better.

00:29:10,752 --> 00:29:12,932 [Speaker 0]
Th-there's personal commitment, there's

00:29:12,972 --> 00:29:15,492 [Speaker 0]
putting best practices in place, there's

00:29:15,592 --> 00:29:17,692 [Speaker 0]
learning and making sure we never do that

00:29:17,772 --> 00:29:20,442 [Speaker 0]
again or do something like that. But-- And

00:29:20,472 --> 00:29:23,242 [Speaker 0]
then, uh, t-Hina, to your question, um,

00:29:23,772 --> 00:29:26,322 [Speaker 0]
it is very segmented how it's, how it's

00:29:26,352 --> 00:29:28,762 [Speaker 0]
explained, right? So the comments, when

00:29:28,812 --> 00:29:30,632 [Speaker 0]
you do submit the official comments to the

00:29:30,712 --> 00:29:33,442 [Speaker 0]
EIS, you know, ex-- saying, "We would

00:29:33,472 --> 00:29:35,622 [Speaker 0]
like a more comprehensive," [chuckles]

00:29:35,632 --> 00:29:37,092 [Speaker 0]
right, is something they would have to

00:29:37,132 --> 00:29:39,592 [Speaker 0]
respond to in the final.

00:29:41,272 --> 00:29:44,112 [Speaker 12]
E-ex-excuse me. I just wanted to clarify

00:29:44,152 --> 00:29:44,652 [Speaker 12]
to see if

00:29:45,992 --> 00:29:49,052 [Speaker 12]
I understood what you said. Did you say

00:29:49,132 --> 00:29:49,421 [Speaker 12]
that

00:29:50,552 --> 00:29:53,162 [Speaker 12]
you don't know how much electricity

00:29:55,392 --> 00:29:57,392 [Speaker 12]
you would need to run the seven

00:29:57,492 --> 00:30:01,212 [Speaker 12]
telescopes? Is, did I hear you correctly?

00:30:01,292 --> 00:30:03,352 [Speaker 11]
That's correct.

00:30:04,892 --> 00:30:06,222 [Speaker 12]
Because...

00:30:08,792 --> 00:30:10,352 [Speaker 7]
A-Auntie, if I could add a little bit on

00:30:10,392 --> 00:30:13,332 [Speaker 7]
that. There is, uh, preliminary

00:30:13,572 --> 00:30:16,732 [Speaker 7]
expectations that's based on this idea of

00:30:16,872 --> 00:30:19,432 [Speaker 7]
what is the absolute worst footprint that

00:30:19,492 --> 00:30:21,622 [Speaker 7]
could be expected with these small

00:30:21,752 --> 00:30:24,992 [Speaker 7]
sensors. That is what most of the analysis

00:30:25,032 --> 00:30:26,912 [Speaker 7]
in the EIS is based on.

00:30:27,368 --> 00:30:31,228 [Speaker 2]
There are some estimates for what kind of

00:30:31,288 --> 00:30:33,128 [Speaker 2]
load would be expected on the

00:30:33,168 --> 00:30:35,268 [Speaker 2]
infrastructure, not just the power grid,

00:30:35,388 --> 00:30:39,478 [Speaker 2]
but the roads, um, other aspects of the,

00:30:39,528 --> 00:30:42,008 [Speaker 2]
the expected effects that this project

00:30:42,018 --> 00:30:45,338 [Speaker 2]
proposed action might have. So those

00:30:45,428 --> 00:30:47,628 [Speaker 2]
numbers and the analysis is based on what

00:30:47,668 --> 00:30:50,308 [Speaker 2]
could possibly be worse. But that's not to

00:30:50,368 --> 00:30:53,708 [Speaker 2]
say that we know exactly what, what the

00:30:53,728 --> 00:30:55,808 [Speaker 2]
design is gonna require. That's just to

00:30:55,848 --> 00:30:57,908 [Speaker 2]
say that's what the worst would look like.

00:30:57,928 --> 00:31:00,258 [Speaker 6]
And, and, and, and I feel that that's

00:31:00,288 --> 00:31:03,668 [Speaker 6]
what's so faulty, that how can you project

00:31:03,708 --> 00:31:06,548 [Speaker 6]
the consequences to our community and to

00:31:06,588 --> 00:31:07,488 [Speaker 6]
our island

00:31:09,888 --> 00:31:14,388 [Speaker 6]
without even knowing for sure? Thanks.

00:31:14,398 --> 00:31:15,668 [Speaker 6]
[audience clapping]

00:31:16,908 --> 00:31:19,488 [Speaker 7]
Yeah, it's hard. It's like, it's like

00:31:19,528 --> 00:31:21,648 [Speaker 7]
saying, "Okay, let's see the ultimate

00:31:21,688 --> 00:31:23,578 [Speaker 7]
damage we can do and then scale back from

00:31:23,648 --> 00:31:25,458 [Speaker 7]
there." That's really hard to hear, I

00:31:25,508 --> 00:31:27,288 [Speaker 7]
just, just to be honest.

00:31:29,328 --> 00:31:30,628 [Speaker 7]
Uh, there's a question in the-- Are we

00:31:30,748 --> 00:31:31,988 [Speaker 7]
taking questions from the audience at this

00:31:32,008 --> 00:31:32,268 [Speaker 7]
point?

00:31:32,308 --> 00:31:32,648 [Speaker 6]
Not yet.

00:31:32,808 --> 00:31:32,818 [Speaker 7]
Not yet.

00:31:32,818 --> 00:31:32,818 [Speaker 6]
Not yet.

00:31:32,888 --> 00:31:34,508 [Speaker 7]
Okay. Wait, sorry. Please save your

00:31:34,588 --> 00:31:35,948 [Speaker 7]
question, and if we have time at the end,

00:31:35,968 --> 00:31:36,828 [Speaker 7]
we'll come back to you.

00:31:36,838 --> 00:31:38,008 [Speaker 6]
And maybe you could write it down and

00:31:38,028 --> 00:31:39,728 [Speaker 6]
bring it up, and then if we have time, we

00:31:39,768 --> 00:31:43,088 [Speaker 6]
can address them. So question three: Given

00:31:43,128 --> 00:31:44,448 [Speaker 6]
that the summit still lacks a

00:31:44,508 --> 00:31:47,548 [Speaker 6]
comprehensive management plan, why is the

00:31:47,588 --> 00:31:49,708 [Speaker 6]
Air Force treating this as an isolated

00:31:49,748 --> 00:31:52,508 [Speaker 6]
federal review under NEPA instead of first

00:31:52,548 --> 00:31:54,998 [Speaker 6]
addressing the larger failure to

00:31:55,028 --> 00:31:57,378 [Speaker 6]
establish clear limits, protections, and

00:31:57,468 --> 00:32:00,568 [Speaker 6]
accountability for all existing and future

00:32:00,668 --> 00:32:02,148 [Speaker 6]
uses of Haleakalā?

00:32:04,068 --> 00:32:06,998 [Speaker 2]
So I think this question builds off of the

00:32:07,048 --> 00:32:08,088 [Speaker 2]
previous question,

00:32:08,688 --> 00:32:11,468 [Speaker 2]
and I would add to the response earlier

00:32:11,568 --> 00:32:13,548 [Speaker 2]
about which page number. The section is

00:32:13,648 --> 00:32:16,608 [Speaker 2]
three point one point four, and that's the

00:32:16,668 --> 00:32:19,848 [Speaker 2]
introduction for what combined effects

00:32:19,888 --> 00:32:23,798 [Speaker 2]
analysis looks like. Um, it-- that's not

00:32:23,828 --> 00:32:26,108 [Speaker 2]
comprehensive or cumulative, but it is

00:32:26,168 --> 00:32:28,708 [Speaker 2]
combined, and it ensures that the

00:32:28,768 --> 00:32:29,378 [Speaker 2]
incremental

00:32:30,468 --> 00:32:32,308 [Speaker 2]
environmental, cultural, and visual

00:32:32,348 --> 00:32:34,158 [Speaker 2]
effects of the proposed action

00:32:35,008 --> 00:32:37,847 [Speaker 2]
are evaluated in combination with past,

00:32:37,888 --> 00:32:40,508 [Speaker 2]
present, and reasonably foreca-foreseeable

00:32:40,688 --> 00:32:41,528 [Speaker 2]
future actions

00:32:42,508 --> 00:32:44,908 [Speaker 2]
of all the organizations that operate in

00:32:44,928 --> 00:32:47,658 [Speaker 2]
the area, regardless of jurisdiction. Um,

00:32:47,668 --> 00:32:50,468 [Speaker 2]
and then in the following pages in that

00:32:50,528 --> 00:32:53,248 [Speaker 2]
section, for each of the resource areas,

00:32:53,288 --> 00:32:56,818 [Speaker 2]
there is a specific, uh, explicit look at

00:32:56,848 --> 00:32:59,008 [Speaker 2]
the combined effects of that particular

00:32:59,048 --> 00:33:00,988 [Speaker 2]
resource area, so it is a little bit more

00:33:01,008 --> 00:33:01,697 [Speaker 2]
disjointed

00:33:02,308 --> 00:33:04,828 [Speaker 2]
as you go through that whole chapter.

00:33:06,268 --> 00:33:09,228 [Speaker 2]
Establishing a comprehensive management

00:33:09,268 --> 00:33:13,018 [Speaker 2]
plan for the whole summit is

00:33:13,028 --> 00:33:14,828 [Speaker 2]
beyond the statutory authority of the

00:33:14,848 --> 00:33:17,488 [Speaker 2]
Department of the Air Force and outside

00:33:17,528 --> 00:33:20,468 [Speaker 2]
the scope of the proposed action. However,

00:33:20,568 --> 00:33:20,868 [Speaker 2]
we

00:33:22,108 --> 00:33:24,408 [Speaker 2]
see a huge amount of benefit for

00:33:24,428 --> 00:33:26,208 [Speaker 2]
establishing that comprehensive management

00:33:26,288 --> 00:33:28,848 [Speaker 2]
plan, and we want to work with all

00:33:28,908 --> 00:33:30,598 [Speaker 2]
organizations and stakeholders who would

00:33:30,628 --> 00:33:33,548 [Speaker 2]
be interested in contributing to that plan

00:33:33,588 --> 00:33:36,048 [Speaker 2]
to see it through. We're committed, and

00:33:36,128 --> 00:33:38,108 [Speaker 2]
we want to do our part.

00:33:39,088 --> 00:33:40,808 [Speaker 7]
I, I haven't had a chance to look at it

00:33:40,848 --> 00:33:42,828 [Speaker 7]
myself, but I hear there is already a

00:33:42,888 --> 00:33:44,408 [Speaker 7]
community plan,

00:33:45,088 --> 00:33:47,068 [Speaker 7]
like one community plan that was drafted.

00:33:47,148 --> 00:33:49,528 [Speaker 7]
Have you guys looked at that plan?

00:33:50,128 --> 00:33:53,638 [Speaker 2]
Was that the... No. Uh, unless that was

00:33:53,648 --> 00:33:56,408 [Speaker 2]
the last, the old version, which was very

00:33:56,448 --> 00:33:58,668 [Speaker 2]
old.

00:33:58,678 --> 00:33:58,738 [Speaker 13]
The high altitude observatory.

00:33:58,738 --> 00:34:00,708 [Speaker 2]
Is that the high altitude observatory plan

00:34:00,788 --> 00:34:04,268 [Speaker 2]
from two thousand and eighteen?

00:34:04,648 --> 00:34:04,838 [Speaker 6]
It might-

00:34:04,838 --> 00:34:06,468 [Speaker 2]
'Cause that's the last version that we

00:34:06,548 --> 00:34:07,188 [Speaker 2]
have-

00:34:07,228 --> 00:34:07,388 [Speaker 6]
I think-

00:34:07,398 --> 00:34:08,688 [Speaker 2]
-started with.

00:34:10,208 --> 00:34:13,868 [Speaker 7]
Yeah. I just was, I was asked to ask if

00:34:13,908 --> 00:34:15,448 [Speaker 7]
you guys have seen that.

00:34:15,528 --> 00:34:15,968 [Speaker 2]
Yes.

00:34:15,977 --> 00:34:17,968 [Speaker 7]
I, I wanna look at it. I wanna see what

00:34:18,008 --> 00:34:19,588 [Speaker 7]
our community thinks because

00:34:21,628 --> 00:34:24,848 [Speaker 7]
I'm also mistrustful of working with

00:34:24,868 --> 00:34:27,248 [Speaker 7]
[laughs] you guys on a master plan, to be

00:34:27,308 --> 00:34:30,628 [Speaker 7]
totally honest. Um, I think that

00:34:31,788 --> 00:34:34,008 [Speaker 7]
Haleakalā is so special that it actually

00:34:34,048 --> 00:34:36,808 [Speaker 7]
deserves the highest protections. And the

00:34:36,828 --> 00:34:38,948 [Speaker 7]
fact that we already have the Crater

00:34:39,068 --> 00:34:40,848 [Speaker 7]
Summit District, or the, sorry, the

00:34:41,148 --> 00:34:43,888 [Speaker 7]
Haleakalā Crater District on the register

00:34:44,448 --> 00:34:46,128 [Speaker 7]
of national, the National Register of

00:34:46,167 --> 00:34:48,488 [Speaker 7]
Historic Places, but its boundary stops

00:34:48,607 --> 00:34:52,388 [Speaker 7]
just past Puʻu ʻUlula. For some reason,

00:34:52,428 --> 00:34:53,608 [Speaker 7]
probably because of these executive

00:34:53,648 --> 00:34:55,988 [Speaker 7]
orders, it doesn't include that area. But

00:34:56,048 --> 00:34:57,418 [Speaker 7]
I actually think it should extend beyond

00:34:57,448 --> 00:35:00,048 [Speaker 7]
that, far beyond that, to encompass the

00:35:00,108 --> 00:35:04,098 [Speaker 7]
whole summit, at least down to Kanahau,

00:35:04,108 --> 00:35:06,508 [Speaker 7]
because that kuualono is really, really

00:35:06,518 --> 00:35:10,438 [Speaker 7]
special to us. And so I think, as a

00:35:10,468 --> 00:35:12,728 [Speaker 7]
community, we'll be thinking more about

00:35:12,808 --> 00:35:17,848 [Speaker 7]
what that means to us and, and what, um,

00:35:17,868 --> 00:35:19,288 [Speaker 7]
and whether a comprehensive management

00:35:19,348 --> 00:35:22,008 [Speaker 7]
plan is actually the best course of action

00:35:22,248 --> 00:35:24,348 [Speaker 7]
or something else. Um,

00:35:25,228 --> 00:35:28,408 [Speaker 7]
but thank you for your honest answer. Um,

00:35:28,568 --> 00:35:29,388 [Speaker 7]
you mentioned that

00:35:30,248 --> 00:35:33,928 [Speaker 7]
this, this DEIS looks at the impacts

00:35:34,048 --> 00:35:36,048 [Speaker 7]
relative to other things, and one of the

00:35:36,148 --> 00:35:38,288 [Speaker 7]
things that I found upsetting about that

00:35:38,368 --> 00:35:42,048 [Speaker 7]
is that the DKIST has already been built.

00:35:42,108 --> 00:35:44,628 [Speaker 7]
We-- None of us wanted that built. These

00:35:45,468 --> 00:35:47,728 [Speaker 7]
makua of ours have been resisting this for

00:35:47,848 --> 00:35:48,768 [Speaker 7]
generations.

00:35:49,688 --> 00:35:54,108 [Speaker 7]
And then this DEIS tries to say, "Well,

00:35:54,168 --> 00:35:56,498 [Speaker 7]
the DKIST is already there. And

00:35:56,528 --> 00:35:59,148 [Speaker 7]
so if these telescopes are gonna be so

00:35:59,168 --> 00:36:03,308 [Speaker 7]
much smaller, so it isn't a, a significant

00:36:03,368 --> 00:36:05,048 [Speaker 7]
impact to the view planes because the

00:36:05,148 --> 00:36:08,068 [Speaker 7]
DKIST is already there." But that's really

00:36:08,928 --> 00:36:14,508 [Speaker 7]
disingenuous to, to make that be the way

00:36:14,568 --> 00:36:15,848 [Speaker 7]
of evaluating.

00:36:16,068 --> 00:36:18,268 [Speaker 7]
You know? It's like being in a abusive

00:36:18,308 --> 00:36:20,218 [Speaker 7]
relationship and somebody says, you know,

00:36:20,218 --> 00:36:22,178 [Speaker 7]
a woman is like, "Well, he knocked me out

00:36:22,208 --> 00:36:24,138 [Speaker 7]
last week, so if he just slaps me tonight,

00:36:24,168 --> 00:36:26,308 [Speaker 7]
it's not gonna be a problem." It's

00:36:26,388 --> 00:36:30,068 [Speaker 7]
already a really big abuse, so to use that

00:36:30,128 --> 00:36:32,328 [Speaker 7]
as your measuring stick about what else

00:36:32,448 --> 00:36:35,388 [Speaker 7]
should and can be done is, again, really

00:36:35,448 --> 00:36:38,088 [Speaker 7]
hard for us to take. And the, that's all

00:36:38,128 --> 00:36:39,848 [Speaker 7]
the DEIS gives me. It doesn't give me

00:36:39,908 --> 00:36:42,208 [Speaker 7]
anything better, you know. Because when I

00:36:42,268 --> 00:36:46,608 [Speaker 7]
stand up there to do ceremonyThe DKIST is

00:36:46,668 --> 00:36:50,948 [Speaker 7]
so imposing. And on the other side, where

00:36:50,988 --> 00:36:53,568 [Speaker 7]
the other ahu is, if there are seven more

00:36:53,608 --> 00:36:55,468 [Speaker 7]
telescopes there, that's gonna interrupt

00:36:55,528 --> 00:36:58,148 [Speaker 7]
that space, too. And even though they're

00:36:58,168 --> 00:37:00,328 [Speaker 7]
gonna-- even though they would be smaller

00:37:00,368 --> 00:37:02,488 [Speaker 7]
than the DKIST, that doesn't matter. That

00:37:02,528 --> 00:37:04,148 [Speaker 7]
shouldn't be the barometer or the

00:37:04,188 --> 00:37:07,028 [Speaker 7]
measuring stick by which we evaluate

00:37:07,068 --> 00:37:09,688 [Speaker 7]
whether or not it's impactful, which we

00:37:09,728 --> 00:37:12,218 [Speaker 7]
already know it is. So sorry, I just

00:37:12,248 --> 00:37:14,928 [Speaker 7]
needed to say that, um, because you

00:37:14,968 --> 00:37:17,798 [Speaker 7]
brought up the view plane stuff. Any more

00:37:17,848 --> 00:37:20,008 [Speaker 7]
questions on this question or comments

00:37:20,028 --> 00:37:22,628 [Speaker 7]
before we move on?

00:37:24,508 --> 00:37:26,988 [Speaker 6]
Um, so our next question has to do with

00:37:27,048 --> 00:37:27,938 [Speaker 6]
the, um,

00:37:29,468 --> 00:37:32,468 [Speaker 6]
unsafe levels of arsenic. So your soil

00:37:32,548 --> 00:37:34,528 [Speaker 6]
testing identified unsafe levels of

00:37:34,548 --> 00:37:37,508 [Speaker 6]
arsenic. What guarantees can you provide

00:37:37,548 --> 00:37:39,928 [Speaker 6]
that the hazardous materials will not

00:37:39,988 --> 00:37:42,408 [Speaker 6]
contaminate soil or groundwater and what

00:37:42,448 --> 00:37:44,428 [Speaker 6]
binding containment monitoring

00:37:45,108 --> 00:37:47,748 [Speaker 6]
and emergency responses-- response

00:37:47,848 --> 00:37:51,648 [Speaker 6]
measures would be in place? We are-- The

00:37:51,868 --> 00:37:55,508 [Speaker 6]
oil spill, the fuel spill is in all of our

00:37:55,608 --> 00:37:58,788 [Speaker 6]
minds and the fact that there

00:37:58,848 --> 00:38:01,648 [Speaker 6]
was real no immediate response

00:38:02,348 --> 00:38:05,768 [Speaker 6]
to that, and I think we can say, safely

00:38:05,828 --> 00:38:08,828 [Speaker 6]
say until today, there has, it has

00:38:08,928 --> 00:38:12,068 [Speaker 6]
not been managed or, um,

00:38:12,728 --> 00:38:16,888 [Speaker 6]
[lip smack] taken care of. What are you

00:38:16,928 --> 00:38:18,988 [Speaker 6]
gonna do differently to make sure

00:38:20,268 --> 00:38:21,668 [Speaker 6]
that this does not happen

00:38:24,408 --> 00:38:28,668 [Speaker 6]
in this footprint?

00:38:30,868 --> 00:38:31,108 [Speaker 4]
So

00:38:31,748 --> 00:38:33,828 [Speaker 4]
we acknowledge that in pages three dash

00:38:33,968 --> 00:38:36,068 [Speaker 4]
four seven, three dash four nine, it, it

00:38:36,078 --> 00:38:38,778 [Speaker 4]
shows levels of arsenic and, and other

00:38:38,808 --> 00:38:42,608 [Speaker 4]
chemicals. Um, in, in page three dash five

00:38:42,668 --> 00:38:45,368 [Speaker 4]
zero, um, the Department of the Air

00:38:45,468 --> 00:38:47,698 [Speaker 4]
Force, Air Force, Space Force, uh, will

00:38:47,788 --> 00:38:50,108 [Speaker 4]
further define the extent of that impacted

00:38:50,148 --> 00:38:52,768 [Speaker 4]
soil, um, because it's just a sampling

00:38:52,808 --> 00:38:55,368 [Speaker 4]
for the EIS. Um, further analysis will go

00:38:55,388 --> 00:38:56,748 [Speaker 4]
into the soil and either

00:38:58,088 --> 00:39:00,528 [Speaker 4]
conduct proper management of the soil to

00:39:00,568 --> 00:39:02,668 [Speaker 4]
ensure long-term benefits, um,

00:39:03,528 --> 00:39:05,918 [Speaker 4]
so there's no impact to human health or,

00:39:05,948 --> 00:39:08,128 [Speaker 4]
or the environment. So that, that's the

00:39:08,188 --> 00:39:12,088 [Speaker 4]
piece of the EIS talking about the current

00:39:12,148 --> 00:39:14,488 [Speaker 4]
situation at, on the site.

00:39:15,968 --> 00:39:17,448 [Speaker 4]
With respect to, um,

00:39:18,108 --> 00:39:19,688 [Speaker 4]
binding measures, so

00:39:20,328 --> 00:39:21,948 [Speaker 4]
like I said, we, we operate in this

00:39:21,988 --> 00:39:24,228 [Speaker 4]
framework of, of the federal government.

00:39:24,308 --> 00:39:27,088 [Speaker 4]
Um, there are a me- a myriad of binding

00:39:27,098 --> 00:39:29,208 [Speaker 4]
federal and state regulations that we must

00:39:29,248 --> 00:39:33,188 [Speaker 4]
abide to. So the, the agency that we must

00:39:33,208 --> 00:39:34,878 [Speaker 4]
follow is the Environmental Protection

00:39:35,028 --> 00:39:37,608 [Speaker 4]
Agency, um, establishing all the

00:39:37,628 --> 00:39:40,508 [Speaker 4]
regulatory, um, acts and, and plans and,

00:39:40,528 --> 00:39:42,908 [Speaker 4]
and codes and laws, um, that we must

00:39:43,148 --> 00:39:45,288 [Speaker 4]
follow. And additionally, Hawaii has it

00:39:45,388 --> 00:39:49,468 [Speaker 4]
as, as well under the, um, HARs. Um,

00:39:51,228 --> 00:39:53,538 [Speaker 4]
looking in-- at the future, uh, we will

00:39:53,708 --> 00:39:57,128 [Speaker 4]
have to develop a plan for containment,

00:39:57,208 --> 00:39:59,588 [Speaker 4]
um, just as how we're doing with the fuel

00:39:59,708 --> 00:40:02,868 [Speaker 4]
spill right now. And I can expand on the

00:40:02,928 --> 00:40:05,088 [Speaker 4]
f- the current fuel spill status if, if

00:40:05,148 --> 00:40:07,108 [Speaker 4]
you would like a status as well.

00:40:07,168 --> 00:40:08,708 [Speaker 7]
We would love to know more about the

00:40:08,788 --> 00:40:09,788 [Speaker 7]
status of that.

00:40:09,848 --> 00:40:11,248 [Speaker 4]
Okay. Um,

00:40:12,248 --> 00:40:13,248 [Speaker 4]
January twenty twenty-three

00:40:14,608 --> 00:40:16,148 [Speaker 4]
spilled, um,

00:40:17,228 --> 00:40:19,508 [Speaker 4]
and then the current system, the

00:40:19,528 --> 00:40:21,908 [Speaker 4]
bio-venting system, did not get in place

00:40:21,988 --> 00:40:24,638 [Speaker 4]
until July twenty twenty-five. So we're

00:40:24,708 --> 00:40:27,008 [Speaker 4]
looking at a, what is that? A year and a

00:40:27,048 --> 00:40:31,858 [Speaker 4]
half. A year and a half of, of stagnant

00:40:33,168 --> 00:40:34,968 [Speaker 4]
before we put a system. There's a reason

00:40:34,988 --> 00:40:38,668 [Speaker 4]
behind that. Uh, we, we advise-- we, we

00:40:38,748 --> 00:40:41,978 [Speaker 4]
consulted with our cultural advisors, and

00:40:42,108 --> 00:40:44,048 [Speaker 4]
we took the mo- the least invasive

00:40:44,268 --> 00:40:45,978 [Speaker 4]
approach into

00:40:47,528 --> 00:40:49,808 [Speaker 4]
remediating the fix. Um,

00:40:50,468 --> 00:40:53,557 [Speaker 4]
so we did not remove any soil from the

00:40:53,608 --> 00:40:57,168 [Speaker 4]
summit. Uh, everything is in place. So how

00:40:57,208 --> 00:41:00,428 [Speaker 4]
the system works is we're drawing the

00:41:00,508 --> 00:41:04,068 [Speaker 4]
oxygen, um, inherent to the summit

00:41:04,748 --> 00:41:07,688 [Speaker 4]
into the wells, uh, that are there. The

00:41:07,748 --> 00:41:11,448 [Speaker 4]
wells feed microorganisms that al-also are

00:41:11,608 --> 00:41:14,748 [Speaker 4]
inherent in the ground, um, that kind of

00:41:14,828 --> 00:41:17,528 [Speaker 4]
juices them up to eat at the

00:41:17,608 --> 00:41:20,848 [Speaker 4]
diesel. So that is the, the theory behind

00:41:20,908 --> 00:41:22,698 [Speaker 4]
the fuel spill. Um, so it's-

00:41:22,698 --> 00:41:24,048 [Speaker 7]
So you're just airing it out, is what

00:41:24,088 --> 00:41:24,598 [Speaker 7]
you're telling me?

00:41:25,108 --> 00:41:27,588 [Speaker 4]
So the air is to provide more oxygen for

00:41:27,628 --> 00:41:30,168 [Speaker 4]
the bugs to s-

00:41:30,488 --> 00:41:30,878 [Speaker 7]
Do their thing.

00:41:30,888 --> 00:41:33,088 [Speaker 4]
To activate them, correct. Uh, so they can

00:41:33,098 --> 00:41:35,408 [Speaker 4]
start eating away at, at the diesel. So

00:41:36,208 --> 00:41:38,768 [Speaker 4]
that is the strategy.

00:41:40,388 --> 00:41:43,288 [Speaker 6]
You guys have follow-up?

00:41:47,468 --> 00:41:49,568 [Speaker 9]
Thank you. You know what? When we went

00:41:49,608 --> 00:41:51,908 [Speaker 9]
through the process opposing the

00:41:51,928 --> 00:41:54,338 [Speaker 9]
construction of the advanced--

00:41:55,208 --> 00:41:58,208 [Speaker 9]
ATST, Advanced, Advanced Technology Solar

00:41:58,328 --> 00:41:58,948 [Speaker 9]
Telescope,

00:42:00,948 --> 00:42:04,178 [Speaker 9]
we discussed these toxic materials and

00:42:04,288 --> 00:42:07,208 [Speaker 9]
learned that they are used also, I think

00:42:07,248 --> 00:42:11,488 [Speaker 9]
it's for cleaning the, uh, telescopes and

00:42:11,568 --> 00:42:14,128 [Speaker 9]
all these kinds of things. And I

00:42:14,168 --> 00:42:16,917 [Speaker 9]
thought in our discussions it was said

00:42:16,948 --> 00:42:20,578 [Speaker 9]
that these had to be transported down and

00:42:20,628 --> 00:42:26,188 [Speaker 9]
taken off of Maui. Is that the process

00:42:26,288 --> 00:42:27,088 [Speaker 9]
that is being

00:42:27,288 --> 00:42:30,628 [Speaker 9]
followed, and is that the process that

00:42:30,708 --> 00:42:31,768 [Speaker 9]
you're talking about

00:42:32,428 --> 00:42:36,748 [Speaker 9]
also for these proposed seven telescopes?

00:42:36,808 --> 00:42:38,908 [Speaker 9]
The toxic materials that are used for

00:42:39,008 --> 00:42:40,908 [Speaker 9]
whatever purposes,

00:42:42,508 --> 00:42:45,487 [Speaker 9]
are they hauled off of Maui?

00:43:00,038 --> 00:43:03,278 [Speaker 14]
And you, sorry, we were just talking. Uh,

00:43:03,678 --> 00:43:05,948 [Speaker 14]
if we're talking the, the mirror recoating

00:43:06,038 --> 00:43:07,398 [Speaker 14]
facility that's up there

00:43:08,158 --> 00:43:09,198 [Speaker 14]
or just the-- I mean,

00:43:09,938 --> 00:43:11,788 [Speaker 14]
it, it doesn't matter. Uh, it is

00:43:12,518 --> 00:43:13,208 [Speaker 14]
everything that

00:43:13,838 --> 00:43:16,898 [Speaker 14]
if it is identified as hazardous does

00:43:16,978 --> 00:43:17,338 [Speaker 14]
follow

00:43:18,818 --> 00:43:21,438 [Speaker 14]
the mandates that I think we have to abide

00:43:21,478 --> 00:43:21,718 [Speaker 14]
by

00:43:22,618 --> 00:43:25,598 [Speaker 14]
n-nationally. So it all comes down, it's

00:43:25,638 --> 00:43:27,737 [Speaker 14]
contained, comes down, but I honestly

00:43:27,818 --> 00:43:30,738 [Speaker 14]
don't... I, I don't. I

00:43:31,658 --> 00:43:33,247 [Speaker 14]
can't think of, I can't think of anything

00:43:33,298 --> 00:43:35,338 [Speaker 14]
off the top of my head. But it comes down

00:43:35,398 --> 00:43:37,278 [Speaker 14]
and is le- taken off-island

00:43:38,138 --> 00:43:41,198 [Speaker 14]
per disposal purpose, uh, the, the right

00:43:41,258 --> 00:43:44,598 [Speaker 14]
disposal, disposal measures.

00:43:44,658 --> 00:43:46,738 [Speaker 7]
Okay. So, oh-

00:43:46,758 --> 00:43:48,878 [Speaker 6]
I'm sorry, are you saying that all of the

00:43:48,918 --> 00:43:51,698 [Speaker 6]
toxic materials that are utilized for

00:43:51,738 --> 00:43:55,598 [Speaker 6]
whatever purposes for the telescopes are

00:43:55,638 --> 00:43:58,098 [Speaker 6]
taken off Maui? Is that what I'm hearing

00:43:58,138 --> 00:43:59,817 [Speaker 6]
you say?

00:44:01,418 --> 00:44:02,368 [Speaker 14]
Well-

00:44:02,378 --> 00:44:03,618 [Speaker 7]
It's okay if you don't know, you can just

00:44:03,638 --> 00:44:03,698 [Speaker 7]
say.

00:44:03,708 --> 00:44:04,978 [Speaker 14]
No, that's true. Batteries are toxic, so

00:44:05,618 --> 00:44:07,118 [Speaker 14]
yeah, I don't know the entire answer to

00:44:07,178 --> 00:44:07,788 [Speaker 14]
that either.

00:44:07,838 --> 00:44:10,698 [Speaker 7]
Okay. Um, to go back to the arsenic thing,

00:44:10,738 --> 00:44:12,798 [Speaker 7]
what I thought I understood from the DEIS

00:44:12,838 --> 00:44:14,748 [Speaker 7]
is that your guys' proposed strategy at

00:44:14,778 --> 00:44:16,418 [Speaker 7]
the moment is a containment in place

00:44:16,428 --> 00:44:18,198 [Speaker 7]
strategy in which you would take the

00:44:18,238 --> 00:44:20,398 [Speaker 7]
affected soil and put it under two feet of

00:44:20,458 --> 00:44:24,208 [Speaker 7]
clean fill. Um, what if

00:44:24,898 --> 00:44:28,118 [Speaker 7]
that's not good enough? Like, what--

00:44:28,138 --> 00:44:30,358 [Speaker 7]
Arsenic-affected soil that is just shoved

00:44:30,378 --> 00:44:31,378 [Speaker 7]
deeper underground

00:44:32,138 --> 00:44:34,578 [Speaker 7]
only to me says that it's headed faster

00:44:34,698 --> 00:44:37,578 [Speaker 7]
towards the water table. Um, I understand

00:44:37,598 --> 00:44:39,778 [Speaker 7]
not removing the material from the summit,

00:44:39,818 --> 00:44:42,198 [Speaker 7]
not taking the actual physical kino of

00:44:42,238 --> 00:44:44,628 [Speaker 7]
Papa and throwing it away in some other

00:44:44,698 --> 00:44:46,918 [Speaker 7]
place. Yes. I think, um,

00:44:47,718 --> 00:44:50,058 [Speaker 7]
you guys have perhaps looked at cleaning

00:44:50,318 --> 00:44:52,198 [Speaker 7]
it, taking it, cleaning it, and putting it

00:44:52,238 --> 00:44:55,098 [Speaker 7]
back. I don't know. But building 1010

00:44:55,138 --> 00:44:56,898 [Speaker 7]
that this arsenic and these other toxic

00:44:56,918 --> 00:45:00,478 [Speaker 7]
chemicals are coming off of, that thing

00:45:00,558 --> 00:45:03,098 [Speaker 7]
has been rotting up there for I don't know

00:45:03,138 --> 00:45:04,507 [Speaker 7]
how long. Maybe you can tell me.

00:45:05,878 --> 00:45:09,558 [Speaker 7]
And is it in your plan to take down the

00:45:09,578 --> 00:45:12,018 [Speaker 7]
building 1010 materials and take them off

00:45:12,078 --> 00:45:13,958 [Speaker 7]
of Maui? Because that's the source of the

00:45:13,998 --> 00:45:15,158 [Speaker 7]
arsenic, right?

00:45:17,098 --> 00:45:18,218 [Speaker 14]
Taking, I don't-- I'm not sure if we're

00:45:18,238 --> 00:45:20,078 [Speaker 14]
taking down 1010. The FAA building, are we

00:45:20,098 --> 00:45:21,698 [Speaker 14]
taking it down?

00:45:22,498 --> 00:45:23,058 [Speaker 2]
That's an option.

00:45:23,238 --> 00:45:25,818 [Speaker 14]
That is an option. Taking down or

00:45:26,498 --> 00:45:29,907 [Speaker 14]
demoing building 1010 is an option, um,

00:45:30,598 --> 00:45:32,458 [Speaker 14]
on the table.

00:45:32,478 --> 00:45:36,438 [Speaker 7]
And what would happen to the results of

00:45:36,478 --> 00:45:38,238 [Speaker 7]
the demolition, right? You have a pile of

00:45:38,318 --> 00:45:41,198 [Speaker 7]
trash that's been, that is, has arsenic

00:45:41,218 --> 00:45:43,198 [Speaker 7]
and other toxic chemicals in it. What

00:45:43,218 --> 00:45:44,668 [Speaker 7]
would happen to that trash? Because what I

00:45:44,718 --> 00:45:48,498 [Speaker 7]
understand is that, maybe I have this

00:45:48,518 --> 00:45:50,358 [Speaker 7]
wrong, but if you're moving toxic

00:45:50,378 --> 00:45:52,608 [Speaker 7]
chemicals, then you have to start dealing

00:45:52,638 --> 00:45:55,098 [Speaker 7]
with the, the EPA, which is why I'm

00:45:55,108 --> 00:45:56,648 [Speaker 7]
assuming you actually want to just bury

00:45:56,738 --> 00:45:58,238 [Speaker 7]
them there so that you don't have to move

00:45:58,298 --> 00:46:01,668 [Speaker 7]
them and deal with the EPA. But if you're

00:46:01,698 --> 00:46:04,178 [Speaker 7]
gonna demo a building,

00:46:04,258 --> 00:46:07,798 [Speaker 7]
and, like, we don't want that in the

00:46:07,858 --> 00:46:10,748 [Speaker 7]
landfill down here, right? I

00:46:10,818 --> 00:46:14,998 [Speaker 7]
mean, it's hard for us to look at a DEIS,

00:46:15,018 --> 00:46:16,478 [Speaker 7]
understand that there are these toxic

00:46:16,518 --> 00:46:20,058 [Speaker 7]
chemicals, and not see any, you know,

00:46:20,138 --> 00:46:22,078 [Speaker 7]
solutions about how these materials are

00:46:22,098 --> 00:46:24,318 [Speaker 7]
gonna be dealt with other than shoving

00:46:24,358 --> 00:46:26,218 [Speaker 7]
them under-- I mean, not the building

00:46:26,278 --> 00:46:28,438 [Speaker 7]
stuff, but the affected soil, shoving that

00:46:28,478 --> 00:46:31,418 [Speaker 7]
deeper. No-nothing about the building.

00:46:31,458 --> 00:46:32,958 [Speaker 7]
That's really hard.

00:46:34,218 --> 00:46:36,558 [Speaker 2]
So I think one of the, the key aspects of

00:46:36,598 --> 00:46:38,778 [Speaker 2]
the plan is that further testing so that

00:46:38,818 --> 00:46:42,098 [Speaker 2]
we understand how the, the, the extent of

00:46:42,158 --> 00:46:45,758 [Speaker 2]
some of these toxic chemicals might be in

00:46:45,818 --> 00:46:48,748 [Speaker 2]
the soil or in the building prior to doing

00:46:48,778 --> 00:46:50,798 [Speaker 2]
any demolition or doing any removal of a

00:46:50,838 --> 00:46:53,318 [Speaker 2]
material, so that we can apply and comply

00:46:53,378 --> 00:46:55,838 [Speaker 2]
with the appropriate regulations. We're

00:46:55,878 --> 00:46:58,358 [Speaker 2]
not trying to bypass any regulations. We

00:46:58,398 --> 00:47:00,378 [Speaker 2]
are very committed to complying with the

00:47:00,398 --> 00:47:03,098 [Speaker 2]
regulations that are set forth in OSHA and

00:47:03,178 --> 00:47:05,298 [Speaker 2]
all of our-- by everything that the EPA

00:47:05,318 --> 00:47:07,638 [Speaker 2]
ha- directs us to do, so that we

00:47:08,358 --> 00:47:10,778 [Speaker 2]
handle the material appropriately to keep

00:47:10,838 --> 00:47:13,338 [Speaker 2]
people safe, but also to keep it from

00:47:13,358 --> 00:47:15,118 [Speaker 2]
doing any further damage than it might

00:47:15,158 --> 00:47:17,418 [Speaker 2]
have already done, to understand what

00:47:17,518 --> 00:47:20,058 [Speaker 2]
damage might look like that might, that we

00:47:20,118 --> 00:47:23,458 [Speaker 2]
might be able to address. And I'm, I, I'm

00:47:23,498 --> 00:47:25,338 [Speaker 2]
sorry, I can't, I don't know if the EIS

00:47:25,418 --> 00:47:27,458 [Speaker 2]
specifically talks about a future

00:47:27,538 --> 00:47:30,158 [Speaker 2]
situation where we understand what the

00:47:30,218 --> 00:47:32,738 [Speaker 2]
extent is, then what, but I think we can

00:47:32,758 --> 00:47:35,918 [Speaker 2]
definitely take that as feedback and start

00:47:35,958 --> 00:47:36,398 [Speaker 2]
looking at

00:47:37,058 --> 00:47:40,018 [Speaker 2]
what would we do then, right?

00:47:40,038 --> 00:47:42,928 [Speaker 7]
Mahalo. It would be great to know. Any

00:47:42,998 --> 00:47:47,578 [Speaker 7]
more questions on the arsenic? Okay.

00:47:47,618 --> 00:47:49,258 [Speaker 6]
Okay.

00:47:51,458 --> 00:47:53,658 [Speaker 6]
Given the long history of sustained Native

00:47:53,668 --> 00:47:55,978 [Speaker 6]
Hawaiian and broader community resistance

00:47:56,038 --> 00:47:58,998 [Speaker 6]
to military expansi- expansion and

00:47:59,038 --> 00:48:01,558 [Speaker 6]
militarized development across Hawaii,

00:48:01,598 --> 00:48:04,158 [Speaker 6]
from Kahoʻolawe to Mauna Kea, Pohakuloa

00:48:04,278 --> 00:48:07,418 [Speaker 6]
Training Area, Haleakalā, why does the

00:48:07,458 --> 00:48:09,818 [Speaker 6]
military continue to advance projects in

00:48:09,838 --> 00:48:14,158 [Speaker 6]
Hawaii in ways that many people experience

00:48:14,238 --> 00:48:17,248 [Speaker 6]
as disregarding clear and repeated

00:48:17,438 --> 00:48:20,178 [Speaker 6]
opposition from Native Hawaiians and the

00:48:20,198 --> 00:48:22,758 [Speaker 6]
broader Hawaii community?

00:48:22,798 --> 00:48:24,658 [Speaker 14]
So I'm gonna take this one 'cause it's way

00:48:24,758 --> 00:48:27,378 [Speaker 14]
bigger than Space Force, and that's what

00:48:27,518 --> 00:48:30,038 [Speaker 14]
this-- that's why they created the Hawaii

00:48:30,118 --> 00:48:33,938 [Speaker 14]
Coordination Cell to, in answering the

00:48:34,098 --> 00:48:36,058 [Speaker 14]
ways that people

00:48:36,158 --> 00:48:41,018 [Speaker 14]
experience the proposals for projects

00:48:41,238 --> 00:48:43,158 [Speaker 14]
and/or land use

00:48:43,538 --> 00:48:44,648 [Speaker 14]
or other things,

00:48:45,278 --> 00:48:46,158 [Speaker 14]
uh, we are

00:48:47,978 --> 00:48:49,088 [Speaker 14]
trying to guide

00:48:49,738 --> 00:48:52,468 [Speaker 14]
the department in how that is happening. I

00:48:52,538 --> 00:48:55,338 [Speaker 14]
also don't want to

00:48:55,906 --> 00:48:58,036 [Speaker 0]
I wish I could, I could tell everybody

00:48:58,366 --> 00:49:00,066 [Speaker 0]
what they would like to hear, but I also

00:49:00,126 --> 00:49:02,526 [Speaker 0]
feel that I gotta tell you the truth,

00:49:02,586 --> 00:49:06,306 [Speaker 0]
right? And, and, and the truth is that the

00:49:06,366 --> 00:49:09,506 [Speaker 0]
military, for the foreseeable future, is

00:49:09,546 --> 00:49:11,646 [Speaker 0]
going to continue to be in Hawaii.

00:49:13,166 --> 00:49:14,906 [Speaker 0]
And while it is in Hawaii,

00:49:15,646 --> 00:49:18,206 [Speaker 0]
we have a duty

00:49:19,426 --> 00:49:19,946 [Speaker 0]
to

00:49:21,026 --> 00:49:24,866 [Speaker 0]
help them or help the military to improve

00:49:25,486 --> 00:49:28,066 [Speaker 0]
the way it is managing and being

00:49:28,106 --> 00:49:30,606 [Speaker 0]
responsible for the areas within its

00:49:30,626 --> 00:49:34,886 [Speaker 0]
jurisdiction, right? So in answer to the

00:49:34,926 --> 00:49:35,526 [Speaker 0]
question,

00:49:36,586 --> 00:49:38,626 [Speaker 0]
there are continuing

00:49:40,966 --> 00:49:43,406 [Speaker 0]
missions and threats,

00:49:44,206 --> 00:49:44,626 [Speaker 0]
um,

00:49:45,266 --> 00:49:45,786 [Speaker 0]
that

00:49:46,646 --> 00:49:49,846 [Speaker 0]
the military is responding to, and then

00:49:49,906 --> 00:49:53,326 [Speaker 0]
there are statutory requirements that are

00:49:53,386 --> 00:49:56,016 [Speaker 0]
not perfect, like the EIS, 'cause I agree,

00:49:56,046 --> 00:49:58,746 [Speaker 0]
the EIS process says, "Before you do

00:49:58,826 --> 00:50:02,016 [Speaker 0]
anything, identify all the bad things that

00:50:02,046 --> 00:50:04,376 [Speaker 0]
can happen and then move from that,"

00:50:04,406 --> 00:50:08,686 [Speaker 0]
right? Um, we need to improve the way we

00:50:08,726 --> 00:50:11,196 [Speaker 0]
do processes, right? But in

00:50:11,226 --> 00:50:13,596 [Speaker 0]
the, in the bigger, in the bigger

00:50:14,386 --> 00:50:16,456 [Speaker 0]
issue, as

00:50:17,326 --> 00:50:17,926 [Speaker 0]
more

00:50:18,826 --> 00:50:21,466 [Speaker 0]
people become educated, to your point

00:50:21,526 --> 00:50:24,386 [Speaker 0]
earlier, and, and, uh, you know, and more

00:50:24,466 --> 00:50:28,826 [Speaker 0]
people read the history, um, including the

00:50:28,866 --> 00:50:29,766 [Speaker 0]
federal government and the

00:50:29,826 --> 00:50:31,286 [Speaker 0]
decision-makers and the government

00:50:31,386 --> 00:50:35,266 [Speaker 0]
officials, there's a need to be able to

00:50:35,326 --> 00:50:38,836 [Speaker 0]
address that as we continue to deal with

00:50:38,866 --> 00:50:41,476 [Speaker 0]
the mission operation requirements.

00:50:41,546 --> 00:50:43,556 [Speaker 0]
Because the military's role

00:50:44,606 --> 00:50:46,416 [Speaker 0]
fundamentally is to protect

00:50:47,786 --> 00:50:50,426 [Speaker 0]
p-p-p-people and place, and we dis-- we

00:50:50,526 --> 00:50:53,276 [Speaker 0]
can absolutely disagree and do not have

00:50:53,366 --> 00:50:55,506 [Speaker 0]
the best record for protecting place in

00:50:55,546 --> 00:50:58,096 [Speaker 0]
the way that we look at i-- Aloha 'Āina.

00:50:58,126 --> 00:51:01,896 [Speaker 0]
With that being said, as we continue that,

00:51:01,946 --> 00:51:03,856 [Speaker 0]
the, the best we can do is to be as

00:51:03,886 --> 00:51:06,946 [Speaker 0]
transparent and improve the processes,

00:51:07,006 --> 00:51:10,846 [Speaker 0]
continue to communicate, and engage in

00:51:10,886 --> 00:51:14,586 [Speaker 0]
dialogue, not consultation, right? Because

00:51:14,926 --> 00:51:17,326 [Speaker 0]
I hear you loud and clear, consult has

00:51:17,366 --> 00:51:19,046 [Speaker 0]
been interpreted as, "This is what we

00:51:19,126 --> 00:51:22,576 [Speaker 0]
gonna do. We just, like, tell you, 'kay?"

00:51:22,586 --> 00:51:22,806 [Speaker 0]
You know,

00:51:23,586 --> 00:51:27,446 [Speaker 0]
a dialogue that can inform designs and

00:51:27,506 --> 00:51:28,346 [Speaker 0]
decisions.

00:51:29,206 --> 00:51:32,246 [Speaker 0]
And, and I know that's not the popular or,

00:51:32,326 --> 00:51:34,226 [Speaker 0]
uh, the, the-- what people wanna hear,

00:51:34,286 --> 00:51:37,326 [Speaker 0]
but that's, that's the honest truth.

00:51:39,246 --> 00:51:39,606 [Speaker 10]
Okay. So

00:51:40,626 --> 00:51:42,586 [Speaker 10]
can I just add to this? Just bottom line

00:51:42,646 --> 00:51:46,706 [Speaker 10]
for me, historically, the U.S. military

00:51:46,726 --> 00:51:47,346 [Speaker 10]
has not

00:51:48,546 --> 00:51:50,806 [Speaker 10]
at all secured any consent,

00:51:52,986 --> 00:51:55,386 [Speaker 10]
free, informed consent, from so-called

00:51:55,426 --> 00:51:56,586 [Speaker 10]
Native Hawaiians, Hawaiian Kingdom

00:51:56,666 --> 00:52:03,126 [Speaker 10]
subjects, in the encroachment and, uh, the

00:52:03,146 --> 00:52:05,486 [Speaker 10]
destruction of our, our 'āina. And so my

00:52:05,526 --> 00:52:09,046 [Speaker 10]
question, real simply, will Space Force

00:52:09,446 --> 00:52:11,886 [Speaker 10]
move forward and desecrate Haleakalā

00:52:12,406 --> 00:52:16,426 [Speaker 10]
without, without the express

00:52:16,546 --> 00:52:19,766 [Speaker 10]
consent, free and informed, from Native

00:52:19,786 --> 00:52:21,546 [Speaker 10]
Hawaiians?

00:52:23,746 --> 00:52:27,686 [Speaker 0]
I honestly don't know. I c-- I honestly

00:52:27,746 --> 00:52:30,446 [Speaker 0]
don't know. Do, do they, under the

00:52:30,506 --> 00:52:33,036 [Speaker 0]
federal framework, which I understand not

00:52:33,106 --> 00:52:36,466 [Speaker 0]
everybody ag-- here agrees with, given the

00:52:36,506 --> 00:52:40,006 [Speaker 0]
history and everything, do they have the

00:52:40,066 --> 00:52:43,346 [Speaker 0]
federal authority to be able

00:52:43,406 --> 00:52:48,006 [Speaker 0]
to move forward? Yes. Will they? I

00:52:48,016 --> 00:52:49,926 [Speaker 0]
honestly don't know. In the

00:52:49,966 --> 00:52:52,086 [Speaker 0]
discussions that I've been-- we've been

00:52:52,226 --> 00:52:53,566 [Speaker 0]
having, right,

00:52:54,586 --> 00:52:55,786 [Speaker 0]
I, I don't know.

00:52:55,796 --> 00:52:56,676 [Speaker 10]
'Cause I, I think for me, it's just

00:52:56,726 --> 00:52:58,446 [Speaker 10]
important to understand, this is going

00:52:58,486 --> 00:53:00,026 [Speaker 10]
back to that question of consultation. I

00:53:00,066 --> 00:53:01,206 [Speaker 10]
mean, you just witnessed

00:53:02,006 --> 00:53:04,426 [Speaker 10]
dozens and dozens and hundreds of people

00:53:05,446 --> 00:53:07,486 [Speaker 10]
throughout the past years, Native

00:53:07,506 --> 00:53:10,426 [Speaker 10]
Hawaiians and our community at large,

00:53:10,486 --> 00:53:11,986 [Speaker 10]
testify in public

00:53:12,986 --> 00:53:13,805 [Speaker 10]
against

00:53:15,646 --> 00:53:18,186 [Speaker 10]
the military industrialization of our, our

00:53:18,206 --> 00:53:21,756 [Speaker 10]
mauna. And so we've gotten used to the

00:53:21,866 --> 00:53:24,386 [Speaker 10]
sense of consultation being you come, you

00:53:24,466 --> 00:53:26,646 [Speaker 10]
testify, and the military's gonna do what

00:53:26,666 --> 00:53:28,806 [Speaker 10]
they wanna do anyway, including pollute

00:53:28,866 --> 00:53:29,726 [Speaker 10]
and not clean up

00:53:30,806 --> 00:53:32,846 [Speaker 10]
their pollution. So again, that's why for

00:53:32,886 --> 00:53:34,426 [Speaker 10]
me, I think that's the, that's the bottom

00:53:34,466 --> 00:53:36,126 [Speaker 10]
line. So we know exactly-

00:53:36,136 --> 00:53:36,216 [Speaker 0]
Yeah

00:53:36,426 --> 00:53:37,695 [Speaker 10]
... what we talking about, which is

00:53:38,486 --> 00:53:40,926 [Speaker 10]
you will do what you're gonna do anyway

00:53:40,966 --> 00:53:43,746 [Speaker 10]
without the consent. So when a woman is

00:53:43,786 --> 00:53:45,446 [Speaker 10]
forced to perform sexual acts without

00:53:45,506 --> 00:53:48,126 [Speaker 10]
consent, you see, we understand that kind

00:53:48,166 --> 00:53:48,766 [Speaker 10]
of pain,

00:53:49,546 --> 00:53:50,846 [Speaker 10]
because we've been saying for far too

00:53:50,866 --> 00:53:55,826 [Speaker 10]
long, "No, no, no, no, no, no,

00:53:55,886 --> 00:54:00,266 [Speaker 10]
no." And yet, this is why I make the

00:54:00,306 --> 00:54:02,166 [Speaker 10]
comment, you do not see us as human

00:54:02,186 --> 00:54:04,856 [Speaker 10]
beings. And so that's my next question.

00:54:04,926 --> 00:54:07,026 [Speaker 10]
Are Native Hawaiians human beings on this

00:54:07,046 --> 00:54:10,946 [Speaker 10]
planet deserving of human rights?

00:54:11,526 --> 00:54:13,066 [Speaker 0]
Yes.

00:54:13,086 --> 00:54:16,146 [Speaker 0]
[audience clapping] Right? I mean, I'm

00:54:16,206 --> 00:54:18,786 [Speaker 0]
gonna... Yes. Right?

00:54:18,806 --> 00:54:18,836 [Speaker 10]
But-

00:54:18,836 --> 00:54:19,826 [Speaker 0]
There's no but.

00:54:21,306 --> 00:54:24,076 [Speaker 0]
Are you Na- Are you, are you humans? Uh,

00:54:24,076 --> 00:54:25,846 [Speaker 0]
uh, I mean, are we humans as a Native

00:54:25,886 --> 00:54:28,466 [Speaker 0]
Hawaiian deserving of human rights? Yes.

00:54:29,146 --> 00:54:31,566 [Speaker 0]
We're all, we're all... I mean, yes.

00:54:31,606 --> 00:54:33,446 [Speaker 10]
So all humans have history?

00:54:33,486 --> 00:54:33,566 [Speaker 0]
Yes.

00:54:33,626 --> 00:54:35,166 [Speaker 10]
All humans have language. All humans have

00:54:35,246 --> 00:54:36,866 [Speaker 10]
sacred spaces that they protect, right?

00:54:36,906 --> 00:54:37,306 [Speaker 0]
Yes.

00:54:37,346 --> 00:54:38,046 [Speaker 10]
Correct.

00:54:38,086 --> 00:54:38,926 [Speaker 0]
Yes.

00:54:38,986 --> 00:54:41,046 [Speaker 10]
So you recognize that we do?

00:54:41,106 --> 00:54:41,526 [Speaker 0]
Yes.

00:54:41,566 --> 00:54:44,346 [Speaker 10]
Yes. But you, by choice,

00:54:45,466 --> 00:54:47,266 [Speaker 10]
refuse to acknowledge and protect those

00:54:47,286 --> 00:54:49,416 [Speaker 10]
things, which is our rights. That's my

00:54:49,446 --> 00:54:51,096 [Speaker 10]
question.

00:54:51,126 --> 00:54:52,066 [Speaker 0]
And my re-

00:54:53,406 --> 00:54:54,136 [Speaker 10]
You don't treat us as humans. That's the

00:54:54,136 --> 00:54:54,136 [Speaker 10]
point.

00:54:54,206 --> 00:54:56,086 [Speaker 0]
I don't think it's binary. I don't think

00:54:56,146 --> 00:54:58,126 [Speaker 0]
it's yes or no. And, and that's where we

00:54:58,186 --> 00:55:00,586 [Speaker 0]
may agree to disagree, but I don't, I

00:55:00,606 --> 00:55:01,806 [Speaker 0]
don't think it's yes or no.

00:55:04,206 --> 00:55:07,126 [Speaker 6]
Yeah, I, there's, there's-- it's not that

00:55:07,166 --> 00:55:07,435 [Speaker 6]
simple

00:55:08,926 --> 00:55:10,086 [Speaker 15]
[audience murmuring]

00:55:10,226 --> 00:55:12,196 [Speaker 7]
Um, before we-- We're, we're gonna move to

00:55:12,226 --> 00:55:14,306 [Speaker 7]
the next question, um, but just on that

00:55:14,316 --> 00:55:16,136 [Speaker 7]
thing of protecting people and place, I

00:55:16,146 --> 00:55:18,176 [Speaker 7]
know you say that that's the mission of

00:55:18,206 --> 00:55:21,116 [Speaker 7]
the military, but we can already see right

00:55:21,146 --> 00:55:24,426 [Speaker 7]
in this very moment that that's not

00:55:24,466 --> 00:55:25,266 [Speaker 7]
what's happening,

00:55:26,526 --> 00:55:29,346 [Speaker 7]
that the military is constantly putting us

00:55:29,506 --> 00:55:32,146 [Speaker 7]
in danger. The, you know, America, I

00:55:32,186 --> 00:55:33,986 [Speaker 7]
don't particularly consider us a part of

00:55:34,026 --> 00:55:34,626 [Speaker 7]
America, but

00:55:35,686 --> 00:55:38,486 [Speaker 7]
we are occupied, and so we are dragged in.

00:55:38,506 --> 00:55:40,426 [Speaker 7]
But America is being put in a very, very

00:55:40,526 --> 00:55:41,806 [Speaker 7]
dangerous situation right now,

00:55:42,586 --> 00:55:45,626 [Speaker 7]
and, and I think most of the public is, is

00:55:45,666 --> 00:55:48,446 [Speaker 7]
not in favor of that. And so I know you

00:55:48,486 --> 00:55:50,106 [Speaker 7]
say that it's protect people and place,

00:55:50,126 --> 00:55:53,866 [Speaker 7]
but that's not what we are seeing. Okay,

00:55:53,886 --> 00:55:54,606 [Speaker 7]
is this our-

00:55:54,646 --> 00:55:56,066 [Speaker 6]
This is our last question

00:55:57,106 --> 00:55:57,136 [Speaker 7]
... last question?

00:55:57,186 --> 00:55:59,386 [Speaker 6]
Um, what alternatives did the Air Force

00:55:59,486 --> 00:56:02,386 [Speaker 6]
seriously consider that would reduce or

00:56:02,466 --> 00:56:04,266 [Speaker 6]
eliminate further construction on

00:56:04,306 --> 00:56:06,866 [Speaker 6]
Haleakalā? And why should the community

00:56:06,906 --> 00:56:09,566 [Speaker 6]
believe this project is necessary when the

00:56:09,606 --> 00:56:11,886 [Speaker 6]
real alternative is simply no further

00:56:11,926 --> 00:56:12,676 [Speaker 6]
expansion

00:56:13,346 --> 00:56:16,906 [Speaker 6]
of the military footprint on Maui?

00:56:18,286 --> 00:56:20,806 [Speaker 7]
I think to even make that clearer, we

00:56:20,846 --> 00:56:24,256 [Speaker 7]
didn't find in the DEIS, like, there was,

00:56:24,286 --> 00:56:27,666 [Speaker 7]
like, a paragraph that I read, I think.

00:56:27,686 --> 00:56:30,626 [Speaker 7]
But no, like, we went to such and such a

00:56:30,646 --> 00:56:33,686 [Speaker 7]
site. It exists at this elevation. This,

00:56:33,726 --> 00:56:36,176 [Speaker 7]
you know, these are the reasons why it's

00:56:36,226 --> 00:56:39,556 [Speaker 7]
not whatev. Like, I di- I-- maybe I missed

00:56:39,606 --> 00:56:42,646 [Speaker 7]
it again, but I didn't see any rigorous

00:56:42,686 --> 00:56:45,786 [Speaker 7]
analysis of alternative sites.

00:56:48,286 --> 00:56:50,646 [Speaker 1]
So first, I think, um, I'll start off with

00:56:50,706 --> 00:56:54,146 [Speaker 1]
explaining the, the value that Haleakalā

00:56:54,156 --> 00:56:56,446 [Speaker 1]
provides us. Uh, and you may already know

00:56:56,486 --> 00:56:57,426 [Speaker 1]
this, and I apologize.

00:56:57,486 --> 00:56:59,266 [Speaker 7]
I do. I do. And so I just-

00:56:59,276 --> 00:56:59,276 [Speaker 1]
S-

00:56:59,306 --> 00:57:00,816 [Speaker 7]
I would like to keep it to, like, the

00:57:01,046 --> 00:57:02,806 [Speaker 7]
other sites, 'cause I don't, we don't need

00:57:02,846 --> 00:57:04,486 [Speaker 7]
to be convinced about our mountain. We

00:57:04,506 --> 00:57:06,496 [Speaker 7]
know it's the best thing ever. Um

00:57:06,906 --> 00:57:06,916 [Speaker 7]
[chuckles]-

00:57:06,926 --> 00:57:07,196 [Speaker 1]
Well, but, but-

00:57:07,226 --> 00:57:09,006 [Speaker 7]
What about the other places?

00:57:09,046 --> 00:57:12,896 [Speaker 1]
Right. So Haleakalā is the best, uh, has

00:57:12,906 --> 00:57:14,666 [Speaker 1]
the best nighttime vie- or the third best

00:57:14,706 --> 00:57:17,036 [Speaker 1]
nighttime viewing in the world. The first

00:57:17,106 --> 00:57:19,686 [Speaker 1]
best is Mauna Kea. We did look at Mauna

00:57:19,786 --> 00:57:21,466 [Speaker 1]
Kea. Uh, however-

00:57:21,566 --> 00:57:23,206 [Speaker 7]
Again, these are not even the, I-

00:57:23,276 --> 00:57:23,276 [Speaker 1]
I know

00:57:23,276 --> 00:57:24,746 [Speaker 7]
What I'm saying is we don't wanna talk

00:57:24,806 --> 00:57:26,526 [Speaker 7]
about our mountain or Mauna Kea.

00:57:26,536 --> 00:57:26,546 [Speaker 1]
Right.

00:57:26,566 --> 00:57:28,346 [Speaker 7]
We wanna talk about other places

00:57:28,606 --> 00:57:31,766 [Speaker 7]
[audience murmuring] outside Hawaii. Where

00:57:31,946 --> 00:57:35,466 [Speaker 7]
else have you really done a deep analysis

00:57:35,526 --> 00:57:37,626 [Speaker 7]
of other sites? Because, I ask this

00:57:37,666 --> 00:57:40,306 [Speaker 7]
because this is not the DKIST staring at

00:57:40,346 --> 00:57:42,606 [Speaker 7]
the sun. This is not apparent, uh,

00:57:42,686 --> 00:57:44,836 [Speaker 7]
supposedly not telescopes that are looking

00:57:44,866 --> 00:57:47,116 [Speaker 7]
way deep into space. If you're tracking

00:57:47,116 --> 00:57:49,906 [Speaker 7]
near Earth orbit objects, I w- I would

00:57:49,946 --> 00:57:51,646 [Speaker 7]
think you could do that from a whole bunch

00:57:51,686 --> 00:57:53,406 [Speaker 7]
of other places, that you do not need to

00:57:53,446 --> 00:57:55,966 [Speaker 7]
be up here.

00:57:55,986 --> 00:57:59,996 [Speaker 15]
[audience applauding]

00:58:00,046 --> 00:58:02,026 [Speaker 7]
So I would like to hear more about the,

00:58:02,066 --> 00:58:03,026 [Speaker 7]
the alternative sites

00:58:03,046 --> 00:58:07,266 [Speaker 7]
analysis.

00:58:09,386 --> 00:58:11,386 [Speaker 1]
So the, the value that Haleakalā pla-

00:58:11,406 --> 00:58:12,836 [Speaker 1]
provides is, like, an order of magnitude

00:58:12,836 --> 00:58:12,836 [Speaker 1]
everywhere-

00:58:12,836 --> 00:58:13,986 [Speaker 7]
Does that mean you don't have an answer? I

00:58:14,126 --> 00:58:15,536 [Speaker 7]
don't want to hear about Haleakalā,

00:58:15,606 --> 00:58:17,666 [Speaker 7]
brother. I'm sorry to stop you. I

00:58:17,686 --> 00:58:19,706 [Speaker 7]
[chuckles], I'm not trying to disrespect

00:58:19,766 --> 00:58:21,706 [Speaker 7]
you, but I really, please don't tell me

00:58:21,766 --> 00:58:22,886 [Speaker 7]
about Haleakalā.

00:58:22,896 --> 00:58:22,896 [Speaker 1]
And-

00:58:22,966 --> 00:58:25,146 [Speaker 7]
Tell me about another place that you have

00:58:25,826 --> 00:58:28,526 [Speaker 7]
actually deeply considered.

00:58:29,466 --> 00:58:30,986 [Speaker 7]
And if, if there is no place, you can just

00:58:31,026 --> 00:58:33,246 [Speaker 7]
say, "We haven't." It's okay to say that.

00:58:33,266 --> 00:58:34,846 [Speaker 1]
No, I guess what I'm, what I'm trying to

00:58:34,866 --> 00:58:37,316 [Speaker 1]
say is, when we go to sea level, the, it

00:58:37,346 --> 00:58:39,546 [Speaker 1]
is an order of magnitude worse for seeing.

00:58:39,566 --> 00:58:41,066 [Speaker 7]
But I'm not, there's a lot of other

00:58:41,135 --> 00:58:41,516 [Speaker 7]
places-

00:58:41,516 --> 00:58:41,516 [Speaker 1]
And we can't-

00:58:41,516 --> 00:58:42,855 [Speaker 7]
... that are not at sea level in the

00:58:42,906 --> 00:58:43,566 [Speaker 7]
world.

00:58:43,586 --> 00:58:44,846 [Speaker 15]
[audience murmuring]

00:58:44,906 --> 00:58:46,176 [Speaker 1]
Right. But then there's the, the weather

00:58:46,176 --> 00:58:46,176 [Speaker 1]
and stuff.

00:58:46,186 --> 00:58:47,766 [Speaker 7]
I mean, my husband put together a whole

00:58:47,906 --> 00:58:49,806 [Speaker 7]
list of alternative sites.

00:58:53,246 --> 00:58:57,466 [Speaker 7]
Did, did you actually really look at them?

00:58:58,126 --> 00:58:58,626 [Speaker 3]
Yes.

00:58:59,926 --> 00:59:00,146 [Speaker 7]
Okay.

00:59:00,166 --> 00:59:00,196 [Speaker 3]
Yes.

00:59:00,196 --> 00:59:01,506 [Speaker 7]
Well then, well, how come there wasn't

00:59:01,516 --> 00:59:03,716 [Speaker 7]
detailed information in the DEIS about

00:59:03,766 --> 00:59:06,426 [Speaker 7]
that? 'Cause it leaves us to go, "Wow,

00:59:06,486 --> 00:59:09,666 [Speaker 7]
they never even look anywhere else."

00:59:11,706 --> 00:59:14,286 [Speaker 3]
I, I cannot answer that part. I do know

00:59:14,326 --> 00:59:18,166 [Speaker 3]
that you cannot replicate what is

00:59:18,246 --> 00:59:21,566 [Speaker 3]
here. In the middle of the Pacific with

00:59:21,605 --> 00:59:22,816 [Speaker 3]
the trade winds at ten-

00:59:22,816 --> 00:59:23,136 [Speaker 7]
I know.

00:59:23,146 --> 00:59:23,906 [Speaker 3]
No.

00:59:23,966 --> 00:59:25,126 [Speaker 7]
We know. We know.

00:59:25,136 --> 00:59:26,966 [Speaker 15]
[audience murmuring]

00:59:26,986 --> 00:59:29,226 [Speaker 3]
Everybody knows. Uh, uh, and I'm not

00:59:29,286 --> 00:59:31,806 [Speaker 3]
talking from a cultural perspective. I'm

00:59:32,186 --> 00:59:35,646 [Speaker 3]
talking from... And, and these guys have

00:59:35,666 --> 00:59:37,995 [Speaker 3]
the PhDs. I'm, I don't have

00:59:38,026 --> 00:59:41,666 [Speaker 3]
one. But at ten thousand feet, with the

00:59:41,706 --> 00:59:43,326 [Speaker 3]
viewing conditions that we have

00:59:43,946 --> 00:59:46,506 [Speaker 3]
and the inversion layer at six to seven

00:59:46,606 --> 00:59:49,386 [Speaker 3]
thousand feet that temps down all the s-

00:59:49,446 --> 00:59:51,886 [Speaker 3]
all the particulates, you know, in the air

00:59:52,126 --> 00:59:53,026 [Speaker 3]
and everything else, so when you're

00:59:53,036 --> 00:59:55,626 [Speaker 3]
looking in the highway or the, a hot road

00:59:55,646 --> 00:59:56,806 [Speaker 3]
and you see the shimmer,

00:59:57,866 --> 00:59:59,666 [Speaker 3]
up there you don't have one. We have a

00:59:59,706 --> 01:00:02,866 [Speaker 3]
picture inside the lobby that shows the

01:00:02,906 --> 01:00:06,306 [Speaker 3]
difference of what you can see at sea

01:00:06,366 --> 01:00:09,326 [Speaker 3]
level, whether it's here or pretty much

01:00:09,386 --> 01:00:11,896 [Speaker 3]
anywhere else in the world, and what you

01:00:11,926 --> 01:00:14,146 [Speaker 3]
can see at Haleakalā. You put your thumb

01:00:14,206 --> 01:00:17,056 [Speaker 3]
up on the sun down in Kihei or down here,

01:00:17,066 --> 01:00:19,066 [Speaker 3]
whatever, and you're gonna see the big

01:00:19,126 --> 01:00:22,206 [Speaker 3]
halo going around your thumb. Promise. To

01:00:22,226 --> 01:00:24,476 [Speaker 3]
do that next time. Okay? Just go like

01:00:24,526 --> 01:00:25,876 [Speaker 3]
this, and you're gonna see the big, like,

01:00:25,946 --> 01:00:26,856 [Speaker 3]
halo all around.

01:00:26,856 --> 01:00:29,386 [Speaker 7]
Yeah. We, we, we understand that it's the

01:00:29,426 --> 01:00:32,026 [Speaker 7]
clearest, most beautiful air.

01:00:32,446 --> 01:00:32,626 [Speaker 3]
And

01:00:34,186 --> 01:00:35,406 [Speaker 3]
there's no other place that we can

01:00:35,446 --> 01:00:36,876 [Speaker 3]
replicate that type of-

01:00:36,886 --> 01:00:38,706 [Speaker 7]
There's no other place you can replicate,

01:00:38,846 --> 01:00:41,026 [Speaker 7]
so you haven't looked deeply at any other

01:00:41,086 --> 01:00:41,686 [Speaker 7]
places.

01:00:41,766 --> 01:00:45,206 [Speaker 15]
[audience murmuring]

01:00:45,226 --> 01:00:46,686 [Speaker 3]
There's Chile and

01:00:47,346 --> 01:00:47,536 [Speaker 3]
Mauna Kea.

01:00:47,546 --> 01:00:49,046 [Speaker 7]
Uh-huh.

01:00:49,086 --> 01:00:50,226 [Speaker 3]
Those are the two.

01:00:50,286 --> 01:00:50,546 [Speaker 7]
And

01:00:51,706 --> 01:00:55,216 [Speaker 7]
does this mean that, like, you, like...

01:00:55,246 --> 01:00:56,546 [Speaker 7]
Share with me what you discovered about

01:00:56,586 --> 01:00:58,766 [Speaker 7]
Chile. What-

01:00:58,806 --> 01:01:00,286 [Speaker 3]
It's not accessible to-

01:01:01,446 --> 01:01:04,726 [Speaker 7]
But it is up here. This is accessible.

01:01:04,746 --> 01:01:07,106 [Speaker 7]
Because the, the very reasons that you are

01:01:07,386 --> 01:01:08,926 [Speaker 7]
saying that,

01:01:09,826 --> 01:01:13,884 [Speaker 7]
that this is the best place, right?It's,

01:01:13,934 --> 01:01:16,174 [Speaker 7]
it's the exact-- It's like looking in a

01:01:16,194 --> 01:01:18,704 [Speaker 7]
mirror. That is why-

01:01:18,874 --> 01:01:18,884 [Speaker 14]
Yes.

01:01:18,884 --> 01:01:20,494 [Speaker 7]
[chuckles] That is why it's sacred to us.

01:01:20,534 --> 01:01:23,714 [Speaker 7]
We understand that already. We know that.

01:01:24,894 --> 01:01:26,934 [Speaker 14]
And I don't disagree with you.

01:01:26,994 --> 01:01:27,894 [Speaker 7]
Okay.

01:01:27,914 --> 01:01:28,204 [Speaker 14]
I don't.

01:01:28,214 --> 01:01:30,374 [Speaker 7]
But thank you for making-- I just wanna--

01:01:30,414 --> 01:01:32,714 [Speaker 7]
For, for the record, the answer is no,

01:01:32,954 --> 01:01:34,454 [Speaker 7]
there are not

01:01:35,414 --> 01:01:37,634 [Speaker 7]
detailed analyses of other sites at this

01:01:37,694 --> 01:01:41,494 [Speaker 7]
time, at this current time.

01:01:43,194 --> 01:01:44,254 [Speaker 14]
I would defer that answer

01:01:45,054 --> 01:01:48,134 [Speaker 14]
to someone smarter than me. Yes.

01:01:48,214 --> 01:01:51,074 [Speaker 7]
Okay. Does-- Are any of you guys qualified

01:01:51,194 --> 01:01:51,574 [Speaker 7]
to-

01:01:51,584 --> 01:01:51,654 [Speaker 14]
[chuckles]

01:01:51,674 --> 01:01:54,694 [Speaker 7]
-answer that question? Okay, that's an I

01:01:54,734 --> 01:01:55,954 [Speaker 7]
don't know. That's great. That-- I ju-

01:01:55,974 --> 01:01:57,394 [Speaker 7]
that's all I need. Thank you. Thank you

01:01:57,414 --> 01:02:00,844 [Speaker 7]
very much. Um, any other mana'o on that

01:02:00,874 --> 01:02:01,954 [Speaker 7]
question?

01:02:03,034 --> 01:02:05,474 [Speaker 7]
Okay. Uh, do we have to wrap it up? Do we

01:02:05,494 --> 01:02:06,454 [Speaker 7]
have time for-

01:02:06,494 --> 01:02:07,134 [Speaker 2]
Hina, sorry.

01:02:07,144 --> 01:02:07,994 [Speaker 7]
-anything else?

01:02:08,014 --> 01:02:08,024 [Speaker 2]
I-

01:02:08,034 --> 01:02:08,444 [Speaker 7]
Yes.

01:02:08,454 --> 01:02:10,534 [Speaker 2]
It's-- So you're looking for the detailed

01:02:10,594 --> 01:02:12,574 [Speaker 2]
analysis, but there is no detailed

01:02:12,584 --> 01:02:15,984 [Speaker 2]
analysis in the EIS. Sites in CONUS, or

01:02:16,034 --> 01:02:18,694 [Speaker 2]
the continental United States, were, uh,

01:02:18,754 --> 01:02:20,704 [Speaker 2]
included in the mission analysis, but

01:02:20,714 --> 01:02:22,494 [Speaker 2]
there were reasons, and some of them are

01:02:22,504 --> 01:02:24,474 [Speaker 2]
listed in the EIS. I don't remember what

01:02:24,514 --> 01:02:26,504 [Speaker 2]
section, but I can go look after this and

01:02:26,534 --> 01:02:28,524 [Speaker 2]
follow up with you so you can review it as

01:02:28,554 --> 01:02:31,334 [Speaker 2]
well. Um, in those sections, it doesn't

01:02:31,374 --> 01:02:34,084 [Speaker 2]
explicitly talk about all of the places in

01:02:34,114 --> 01:02:36,814 [Speaker 2]
CONUS that were considered, but it does

01:02:36,834 --> 01:02:39,634 [Speaker 2]
talk about some of the conclusions of the

01:02:39,674 --> 01:02:41,914 [Speaker 2]
consideration of those locations. So I

01:02:41,934 --> 01:02:43,474 [Speaker 2]
will follow up you-- with you afterwards

01:02:43,494 --> 01:02:45,514 [Speaker 2]
and, and try to point that out.

01:02:45,534 --> 01:02:47,934 [Speaker 7]
Mahalo.

01:02:48,634 --> 01:02:49,114 [Speaker 6]
Okay.

01:02:50,214 --> 01:02:51,104 [Speaker 7]
[speaking Hawaiian] Okay. Um,

01:02:51,314 --> 01:02:55,014 [Speaker 7]
[speaking Hawaiian] Thank you for

01:02:55,074 --> 01:02:56,684 [Speaker 7]
answering our questions. That does not

01:02:56,734 --> 01:02:59,674 [Speaker 7]
happen in these other consultations, the

01:02:59,694 --> 01:03:02,534 [Speaker 7]
way that they are set up. So we appreciate

01:03:02,544 --> 01:03:04,694 [Speaker 7]
that you actually came to engage with us

01:03:04,754 --> 01:03:08,954 [Speaker 7]
on our terms here tonight. Um, yeah, so

01:03:08,994 --> 01:03:09,704 [Speaker 7]
thank you for that.

01:03:11,234 --> 01:03:12,754 [Speaker 7]
And-

01:03:13,334 --> 01:03:14,014 [Speaker 16]
[applause]

01:03:14,024 --> 01:03:16,874 [Speaker 7]
And, uh, thank you. And I just wanna say

01:03:17,214 --> 01:03:19,154 [Speaker 7]
thank you very much, 'cause this is the

01:03:19,194 --> 01:03:21,224 [Speaker 7]
type of engagement we want to. We don't

01:03:21,274 --> 01:03:23,534 [Speaker 7]
want to only engage in statutory

01:03:23,613 --> 01:03:25,674 [Speaker 7]
requirements like environmental impact

01:03:25,774 --> 01:03:28,384 [Speaker 7]
statements, where we have time limits and

01:03:28,434 --> 01:03:31,574 [Speaker 7]
cannot kukakuka, right? So we would like

01:03:31,634 --> 01:03:33,654 [Speaker 7]
to do more of these, and we are trying to

01:03:33,714 --> 01:03:36,654 [Speaker 7]
do more of them across the state. So thank

01:03:36,694 --> 01:03:38,274 [Speaker 7]
you very much.

01:03:38,294 --> 01:03:38,434 [Speaker 6]
And-

01:03:38,454 --> 01:03:39,534 [Speaker 7]
Mahalo.

01:03:39,554 --> 01:03:41,134 [Speaker 6]
And I would li-- I would also like to say

01:03:41,214 --> 01:03:43,614 [Speaker 6]
that we hope that this, I, I know I'm, I

01:03:43,654 --> 01:03:45,894 [Speaker 6]
heard you mention that this is not an

01:03:45,934 --> 01:03:48,994 [Speaker 6]
official sort of meeting, but please know

01:03:49,034 --> 01:03:53,114 [Speaker 6]
that we expect [chuckles] our comments,

01:03:53,214 --> 01:03:55,714 [Speaker 6]
um, and our questions to be

01:03:55,754 --> 01:03:57,094 [Speaker 6]
considered officially,

01:03:57,734 --> 01:04:00,774 [Speaker 6]
um, or this would just be a waste of a- of

01:04:00,834 --> 01:04:04,364 [Speaker 6]
all of our times. Um, and I

01:04:04,414 --> 01:04:09,394 [Speaker 6]
think, again, we appreciate your, um,

01:04:09,454 --> 01:04:11,414 [Speaker 6]
engagement in this, you

01:04:11,454 --> 01:04:14,054 [Speaker 6]
know, uncomfortable, um, but really

01:04:14,114 --> 01:04:17,734 [Speaker 6]
important dialogue. Um, and I think what

01:04:17,774 --> 01:04:22,854 [Speaker 6]
it did for at least me is to, um, some of

01:04:22,874 --> 01:04:24,734 [Speaker 6]
your honest answers, we,

01:04:24,774 --> 01:04:26,584 [Speaker 6]
we know this. We know you're not really

01:04:26,674 --> 01:04:28,694 [Speaker 6]
considering other places. We know you

01:04:28,754 --> 01:04:31,794 [Speaker 6]
don't know certain things. Um, we know

01:04:31,814 --> 01:04:33,894 [Speaker 6]
that you're-- we're trapped in a

01:04:33,954 --> 01:04:37,414 [Speaker 6]
consultation process that is not built for

01:04:37,514 --> 01:04:40,934 [Speaker 6]
us to win. Um, but like

01:04:40,974 --> 01:04:43,394 [Speaker 6]
somebody said earlier, we will continue,

01:04:43,894 --> 01:04:46,814 [Speaker 6]
and we'll always continue to stand in

01:04:46,894 --> 01:04:49,134 [Speaker 6]
protection and aloha aina of our place.

01:04:49,594 --> 01:04:52,974 [Speaker 6]
Even though the game is set up against us,

01:04:53,014 --> 01:04:56,474 [Speaker 6]
we a little bit used to that, but we, we

01:04:56,534 --> 01:04:58,874 [Speaker 6]
appreciate you saying the truth,

01:04:59,794 --> 01:05:02,774 [Speaker 6]
um, because we know that's the truth. So,

01:05:05,174 --> 01:05:06,834 [Speaker 6]
you know, we're in this, we're in, we're

01:05:06,874 --> 01:05:08,764 [Speaker 6]
in this place. Um-

01:05:09,614 --> 01:05:10,954 [Speaker 7]
The honesty is appreciated